Pistol Brace Amnesty/Registration
- Thread starter Sam75022
- Start date
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Is, based on what we know now, Form 4999 still in play? I have a pistol that scores no more than 3 and so, according to the form, it's not "a shoulder fired design." I haven't run any pistols other than that one across the form nor am I saying I own any others. But I'm curious about the status of the form.
As far as I know yes, the 4999 is still in play. You actually have a pistol with a brace that only scores 3 points? Don't answer that. I thought the 4999 was designed so that virtually no braced pistol would pass the test.
It weighs less than 64 ounces so I get to skip Section II, picking up no points, and go directly to Section III.
In Section III, the 4 sub-parts work out as:
- Length of Pull - 2 points,
- (I have alternate parts to bring this down to 1 point.)
- Attachment method is a standard tube, so - 0 points,
- (A shorter tube might be necessary which would add 1 point.)
- Modifications, none, so - 0 points, and
- (If I use a fin-type brace to reduce the length of pull, that would add 2 points.)
- Peripherals, just an unlimited eye relief red dot, the only sight setup that results in - 0 points.
- (I'm considering iron sights which would add 1 more point but I doubt I'll go that route.)
No but I have all the parts to build it. Once it's together it may turn out that I forgot something but, for now, I don't think so.
The form 4999 is very confusing and maybe you are interpreting it incorrectly. Or maybe I am. This GOA worksheet indicates that less than 64 ounces is a disqualifying factor. Less than 64 ounces means it is not suitable for a brace and must be registered as SBR.
To my understanding, it must be between 64 oz. and 120 oz. and between 12 inches and 26 inches in length. Otherwise it is considered an SBR regardless of other criteria.
You can't skip section II based on less than 64 oz., you can't go any further at all if it does meet both of the above criteria.
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Was visited yesterday by our ”Baby”, now of the dastardly ATF. Baby insists that this comes directly from the FBI & Biden Adm, not from within the ATF.
Of course, Baby is field-level, so that is “for whatever it is worth” to us here.
leVieux
.
Was visited yesterday by our ”Baby”, now of the dastardly ATF. Baby insists that this comes directly from the FBI & Biden Adm, not from within the ATF.
Of course, Baby is field-level, so that is “for whatever it is worth” to us here.
leVieux
.
Hmmm.
I read the 4999 as if it were written in plain English. It doesn't say if the pistol is under 64 ounces, it's automatically an SBR. It simply says that if it's under 64 ounces, Section II does not apply.
I interpreted that as "Go ahead on to Section III." If the real meaning is "You lose." then I didn't see any verbiage that made that clear.
On the form.
I guess I've got a lot more reading to do.
tl;dr - You're right. I should have known I couldn't get that lucky.
I believe it is intentionally ambiguous. Even if a pistol with brace could somehow accrue less than 4 points on the 4999, ATF still reserves the right to classify it as an SBR at their discretion. So there it is, clear as mud.
Another item I read, but don't understand: You can make your pistol legal again simply by removing the brace. UNLESS, the pistol was purchased with the brace installed. Then your only recourse is to SBR it, turn it in, or destroy it. If you purchased and added the brace and pistol separately, you may simply destroy the brace to become legal. I found that on the second page here: https://www.sb-tactical.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/06/ATF-Proposed-Rule-Stabilizing-Braces.pdf
This is so much BS and so confusing, that no one can be certain if they are within the law.
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The Extar EP-9 came with an SBA brace in tthe box, but not installed. I can't remember the brace model, but the buffer tube was plain and the brace was held on by nothing but friction. A little soap and water used to install it.
Considering the 80% frame rule not allowing kits, I wonder how ATF will see the EP-9?
Add to that if a pistol is purchased 2nd hand without the aforementioned "factory" brace, that new owner would never know either. I wouldn't think the 4473 would mention that it did beyond maybe a model number that was specific to having that accessory on it.
That makes two of us. Er, maybe 2 million of us. Or 4-10 million.
I'm sure, if they had the inclination, they could trace it by serial number back to the original manufacturer/LGS that sold it. Or maybe they will start there like they did with the Rare Breed triggers.
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We, and they, all know that this is just pure political harassment, nickel-&-dime’ing, death by tiny cuts, B-S.
The NFA was supposedly in response to the JFK assassination w/ a mail order Carcano; which had ZERO to do with pistol braces or bump stocks, much less with handguns !
We must RESIST !
”SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED!”
leVieux
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We are all behind you and greatful that you're willing to sacrifice yourself as the test Case
Let us know where to donate to your defense and the follow up lawsuit.
But if the AR pistol does not have a brace, then 4999 is not applicable at all.The form 4999 is very confusing and maybe you are interpreting it incorrectly. Or maybe I am. This GOA worksheet indicates that less than 64 ounces is a disqualifying factor. Less than 64 ounces means it is not suitable for a brace and must be registered as SBR.
To my understanding, it must be between 64 oz. and 120 oz. and between 12 inches and 26 inches in length. Otherwise it is considered an SBR regardless of other criteria.
You can't skip section II based on less than 64 oz., you can't go any further at all if it does meet both of the above criteria.
