It's only 200 fps. That only matters in competition with arbitrary rules.But fall short of the 38 Super's power.
I've thought about that myself. I don't love my 125s I have for the magnum and since they're plated I bet they do great in the 9mm. Personally I load HAP .356" for my nines but never have tried .357. I should slug a few barrels to see if I can squeeze a little more accuracy out of a few nines with the mag bullets.
Supposedly it can be loaded to near 357 mag
I thought about getting a .38 super, but after looking at the velocity of the 7.62x25 "Tokarev" cartridge (which is actually just a clone of the old 7.63 Mauser Broomhandle cartridge) and since the 7.62x25 cartridge is about at the lower end of .357 mag velocity and available in military surplus bulk tins, I bought a military surplus Czech CZ52 and Chinese Norinco Tokarev pistols back in the 1990's. The round has a VERY sharp report and will hurt and ring your ears for hours afterwards if hearing protection is not used, and it has a decent recoil but not that bad for the velocity you're getting and not that much more than a standard 9mm. Let me give a personal example of the velocity & penetration capabilities of the 7.62x25 cartridge.
A few years ago, a friend of mine had another friend who wanted to have his Kevlar bullet resistant vest (without trauma plate) tested to see if it would work to save his life against pistol rounds. So my friend brought the vest over to my acreage and we attached it around a very thick walled "Hooters" wings five gallon orange plastic bucket. Then we filled the bucket with water. I do not remember the name brand of the vest.
Next we shot it with just about every common handgun caliber from about a distance of 20 feet. .22LF., .22mag, .25ACP, .32ACP, .32 long rimmed, .38 special, 9mmACP, .380ACP, .45ACP, .357mag, .44mag. Although both the .357mag and .44mag left dents in the bucket, nothing penetrated the vest nor the bucket. In fact you couldn't even tell where the projectiles had hit the vest. So the vest worked very well for protection against all those most commonly encountered rounds in the U.S.
I saved my Czech CZ52 and Chinese Norinco Tokarev pistols in 7.62x25 cartridge for last, because I had a definite feeling that the very high velocity (most powerful military pistol cartridge ever generally issued in Europe) with its 9mm size case head and case diameter but longer than 9mm case body and bottlenecked down to .30 caliber pushing a standard European military full metal copper jacket would penetrate the vest. It did. After just one shot we saw water pouring out of the vest from the water filled bucket. I fired another shot with the CZ52 and water poured from that hole also.
I quickly switched to my 7.62x25 Norinco Tokarev and fired two shots from it. Water poured from those two holes also.
Satisfied that we had tested the vest about as well as anyone could for its ability to stop bullet penetration, we removed it from the bucket and inspected the bucket and the vest.
That's when we discovered the .357mag and .44mag rounds had left heavy dents in the bucket but did not penetrate nor even leave a mark on the vest. Anyone wearing it though, would have had one heck of a bruise trauma or even a broken rib, but would have lived.
The CZ52 and Tokarev pistols in 7.62x25 both had the same penetrating qualities and used the same cartridges from the same military surplus tin pack. Their full copper jackets penetrated the front of the vest like a hot knife through butter, went through the thick plastic bucket, through the water, through the back of the thick plastic bucket, and almost though the back of the vest but hit an additional sheet layer of kevlar and were all embedded in the back of the vest. Anyone wearing that bullet "proof" (resistant) vest might as well not have been wearing it at all if shot with the 7.62x25 Tokarev pistol cartridge. Can anyone say the same for the .32 super? My friend's friend was grateful to know just how well his vest would have protected him (in spite of the holes we put in it with the 7.62x25 projectiles), and he bought another vest with a trama plate in it.
German soldiers at Stalingrad complained that their 9mm parabellum rounds were often not penetrating enough to kill due to the thick heavy wool coats and wool winter clothing worn by the Soviets but the Soviet's PPSH sub gun and Tokarev pistol round (same cartridge for both guns) would go right through the German's thick heavy wool coats. And we confirmed that with our vest test.
So really, at least in my opinion, I see no need for a .38 Super and its expensive and not commonly stocked ammo, when it doesn't come near to the velocity and penetration qualities of the much less expensive, approximately lower end .357mag velocity, full copper jacketed, .30 caliber, bottlenecked 7.62x25 pistol cartridge. And you can get a CZ52 or Tokarev pistol and ammo for much less expense than a .38 super pistol and ammo and put better sights on them than the rudimentary military sights they come with.
I rarely post anymore at firearms forums due to some people who just want to start an argument and flamers who want to mess with me because I invented and patented bumpfire stocks, but I saw this .38 super thread in my email and wanted to relay my experience with velocity and penetration in a pistol cartridge. So that's my experience, opinion and vest test report.
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That breach roller lock is the same strong type of lock used in the WW2 8mm German MG42 machine gun and the modern version of the MG42 used today with a slower rate of fire and in 7.62x51 Nato and called the MG3. I have had no issues with my CZ52 since I bought it decades ago. It is extremely strong and well made.Had a CZ52, didn't the way it felt in my hand.
Then started researching it, and didn't like what I was seeing about it mechanically.
Maybe would have kept it if someone made nice grips for it, and then went after the breach lock roller thing.
Seems like there was some other issue also, but that was years ago.
Thank you.Anyone who causes the ATF to lose their collective minds and lose court cases...Is an OK person in my book.
And many HKs.That breach roller lock is the same strong type of lock used in the WW2 8mm German MG42 machine gun and the modern version of the MG42
But the roller lock of the Czech CZ52 pistol and the MG42/MG3, is irrelevant to the 7.62x25 pistol cartridge I was comparing the velocity and penetration qualities of verses the .38 Super cartridge which is the subject of this thread.
And many HKs.
Didn't say the design was bad, I said that CZ had issues, mostly the rollers were too soft.
Someone was selling replacement rollers, but by the time I picked up mine (maybe 10+ years ago, they were gone.
Oh, and pardon me that I wondered off the 'official' thread topic.
Glad that TGT hired a new thread monitor (you), all the way from FLORIDA....
I've been tempted by a couple nice 1911's in 38 super. Never pulled the trigger because they always are from mid-high end ($$$$) builders. And I just do not want to add another caliber to the ammo shelf.
That's understandable.I rarely post at firearm forums anymore.