Y'all ready for FedCoin™?

[John Sam Rayburn]

At some point, will the value of bitcoin et al be based on something other than the USD? What's your guess?

The value of Bitcoin is not based on the U.S. Dollar.

Like gold, the value of Bitcoin is based upon the work and energy that was expended to mine it.

You can compare the price of Bitcoin to hundreds of other currencies at this website...

https://www.coingecko.com/en/coins/bitcoin

 

[MountainGirl]

The value of Bitcoin is not based on the U.S. Dollar.

Like gold, the value of Bitcoin is based upon the work and energy that was expended to mine it.

You can compare the price of Bitcoin to hundreds of other currencies at this website...

https://www.coingecko.com/en/coins/bitcoin

View attachment 401395

Thanks -
Do you happen to know which common currency BRICS may likely use?

 

[John Sam Rayburn]

Do you happen to know which common currency BRICS may likely use?

They are building a gold-backed Central Bank Digital Currency.

The Russians have been preparing for this since the Marxist Neo-Con Republicans began attacking them in 1991.

This week Padraig Martin published a good audio about this. Worth a listen...

 

[MountainGirl]

They are building a gold-backed Central Bank Digital Currency.

The Russians have been preparing for this since the Marxist Neo-Con Republicans began attacking them in 1991.

View attachment 401517

This week Padraig Martin published a good audio about this. Worth a listen...

Thanks, I'll listen to it -

And to complete the circle of my understanding...

the upcoming digital FedCoin - will be tied solely to the value of USD; as other countries' cbdc's will be tied to their currencies... whereas the BRICs cbdc will be tied to gold, rather than one of an individual country's currency.

Is that correct?

If so, I think for me the penny has finally dropped (<-brit slang), and I have you to thank for that.

 

[MountainGirl]

They are building a gold-backed Central Bank Digital Currency.

The Russians have been preparing for this since the Marxist Neo-Con Republicans began attacking them in 1991.

View attachment 401517

This week Padraig Martin published a good audio about this. Worth a listen...

One last question -

As gold has no intrinsic value in itself, but only in relationship to an established 'currency', of what benefit (other than retaining value independent of a specific failing state) would a gold-backed cbdc be?

Goods and services are priced in one fiat currency or another...regardless of method of payment.

Thanks -

Edit for clarity: I understand (finally) that bitcoin has its own value basis; I'm asking about gold-backed cbdc-s.

 

[TheDan]

As gold has no intrinsic value in itself, but only in relationship to an established 'currency', of what benefit (other than retaining value independent of a specific failing state) would a gold-backed cbdc be?

Gold backed doesn't really mean much unless it is convertible to gold, and I highly doubt they are going to allow conversion.

Currency is a confidence game, and gold backing does inspire confidence in that it shows the issuer of the currency at least has fungible assets available to pay debts if necessary. That's assuming they allow independent audits and people trust the auditors.

 

[ZX9RCAM]

Might be a stupid question, but how will gold or bitcoin be "valued" if paper money is worthless?

 

[MountainGirl]

Might be a stupid question, but how will gold or bitcoin be "valued" if paper money is worthless?

That's not a stupid question at all, and I look forward to others' answers on this because my answer is lame.

The value of the flake of gold in my hand might be equal to a loaf of bread. If things are really hungry out - it might take two flakes. It used to be pepper was used as a kind of currency, i.e., something of value for trade <--which is what 'money' is, after all.

Trade. Barter. Until there's a really good answer to your question, options need to be in hand, imo.


.

 

[TheDan]

Might be a stupid question, but how will gold or bitcoin be "valued" if paper money is worthless?

Like anything else, it's valued based on the negotiating skills of the parties involved.

 

[ZX9RCAM]

Like anything else, it's valued based on the negotiating skills of the parties involved.

So, there's no set value?

 

[Grumps21]

I like the concept of goldbacks. Of course the cost of producing them make it not practical

 

[TheDan]

So, there's no set value?

How do you expect values to be set?

 

[ZX9RCAM]

How do you expect values to be set?

That's what I'm asking.

 

[toddnjoyce]

How do you expect values to be set?

In practice, the value of goods and services are set in monetary units.

Nobody unretarded goes to HEB and argues that a monetary unit of $1 is not worth $1. Every unretard in HEB gets the same consideration when it comes to what $1 is worth.

 

[TheDan]

In practice, the value of goods and services are set in monetary units.

Nobody unretarded goes to HEB and argues that a monetary unit of $1 is not worth $1. Every unretard in HEB gets the same consideration when it comes to what $1 is worth.

Right, so in that scenario HEB is setting the value. They want $1.29 for a can of ranch style beans. Randalls wants $1.25 for a can of ranch style beans. See how the value changes based on the parties involved? Did the value of the $ change, or was it the beans?

Might be a stupid question, but how will gold or bitcoin be "valued" if paper money is worthless?

Going back to your original question to try to answer better... Barring any legal mandating of a value setting, like the old gold convertibility standard, prices are set by a marketplace. A marketplace is just a mass negotiation. When you get down to a one on one exchange the value is negotiable again, albeit often guided by a market price.

...but even in the scenario of a legally set value, if the paper currency is considered worthless (ie no one wants it) then no one is going to pay attention to the legally set value and it will be negotiable again.

So it always just boils down to the parties doing the exchange.

 

[toddnjoyce]

Right, so in that scenario HEB is setting the value.

The value of the goods, not the monetary unit. If you take HEB gold, lead, 9mm ammo, or crypto, HEB will tell you that’s an acceptable monetary unit. Bring USD or a debit or credit card and they will charge your debit or credit card in USD.

If I’m selling land for USD and you offer me gold, ypu might as well have brought Mexican pesos I’ll pass or make it so advantageous for me due to the work I have to do get USDs from a stack of gold because I’m in the land business, not the gold business. Otherwise, if you want the deal you dick with getting USD, because 1USD = 1USD.

 

[MountainGirl]

Right, so in that scenario HEB is setting the value. They want $1.29 for a can of ranch style beans. Randalls wants $1.25 for a can of ranch style beans. See how the value changes based on the parties involved? Did the value of the $ change, or was it the beans?

Going back to your original question to try to answer better... Barring any legal mandating of a value setting, like the old gold convertibility standard, prices are set by a marketplace. A marketplace is just a mass negotiation. When you get down to a one on one exchange the value is negotiable again, albeit often guided by a market price.

...but even in the scenario of a legally set value, if the paper currency is considered worthless (ie no one wants it) then no one is going to pay attention to the legally set value and it will be negotiable again.

So it always just boils down to the parties doing the exchange.

Excellent reply ^^.

Using your HEB example, let's pretend that HEB will accept bitcoin for payment and, even though bitcoin has its own set value, HEB wants $1.29 USD worth of bitcoin in exchange for the can of beans.

It might be the primary advantage to owning bitcoin is that it's NOT tied to any specific currency (thus retaining its own value) - but you'd still be subjected to the outlandish USD price for a can of beans...if your only choice was HEB.

[Unnecessary tangent: Decentralized monetary control is one thing; Federal regulations on vendors to accept only FedCoin - is something else entirely.]

 

[MountainGirl]

The value of the goods, not the monetary unit. If you take HEB gold, lead, 9mm ammo, or crypto, HEB will tell you that’s an acceptable monetary unit. Bring USD or a debit or credit card and they will charge your debit or credit card in USD.

If I’m selling land for USD and you offer me gold, ypu might as well have brought Mexican pesos I’ll pass or make it so advantageous for me due to the work I have to do get USDs from a stack of gold because I’m in the land business, not the gold business. Otherwise, if you want the deal you dick with getting USD, because 1USD = 1USD.

That ^^(bolded) is something I'm not sure we can rely on.
(See my Unnecessary tangent, above)

How long do you think governmental licensing and regulatory agencies will allow HEB to accept anything other than USD ( in fedcoin, crypto or otherwise)... especially when .gov is trying to switch everything over to what they alone can control ?

 

[toddnjoyce]

That ^^(bolded) is something I'm not sure we can rely on.
(See my Unnecessary tangent, above)

How long do you think governmental licensing and regulatory agencies will allow HEB to accept anything other than USD ( in fedcoin, crypto or otherwise)... especially when .gov is trying to switch everything over to what they alone can control ?

Honestly, it doesn’t really matter, even today. Even though US greenback dollars are the official currency of the United States, there’s no requirement for a state or private individual to conduct business solely in USD. The only entity that is requires to conduct business in USD or USD equivalents is the US government.

For example, when the US Treasury accepted payments from my bank in Italy for tax purposes, an intermediate ForEx broker was involved to convert the Euros to USD after the money left my Poste Italia account and before it hit the US Treasury. The intermediary set the exchange rate and made their money of the delta. I simply instructed that the US government had to receive $XXX.XX and PO and their ForEx sent enough EUR to cover the transaction.

Most of this stuff strips down to whether or not two parties can settle on a means for the values to be exchanged.

 

[Eastexasrick]

That ^^(bolded) is something I'm not sure we can rely on.
(See my Unnecessary tangent, above)

How long do you think governmental licensing and regulatory agencies will allow HEB to accept anything other than USD ( in fedcoin, crypto or otherwise)... especially when .gov is trying to switch everything over to what they alone can control ?

There are a few retailers accepting bitcoin. skidtactial.com comes to mind. Not sure how they price, never used it myself.