Multiple People Shot at Texas Church

[majormadmax]

That was my take -

First guy is dead because he was slow to draw.
Second guy was dead because he was too slow to do anything.
Security guard was slow too, but had distance and made his one shot count.

First guy drawing demonstrated how long it takes to do so from concealed carry. Second guy was too close to the shooter to react and appeared to be unarmed. The security guard shot when the opportunity allowed it. I would not consider him "slow" simply because he didn't have a clear shot at the target, I think he did absolutely the best anyone could.

 

[Dad_Roman]

Yep, he had a clear view, a clean shot (no body behind shooter) and the shooter was not looking at him. Everything was on his side, unlike the first guy.

Yea thats a shame. ......and seriously overweight and in a sitting position when he reached. Dont think he ever got it out, could be wrong.

 

[Renegade]

First guy drawing demonstrated how long it takes to do so from concealed carry.

Seemed the gun was way back and hard to get to.

Second guy was too close to the shooter to react and appeared to be unarmed.

No such thing as too close to react. He was textbook condition white and had no clue what was happening or what to do.

The security guard shot when the opportunity allowed it. I would not consider him "slow" simply because he didn't have a clear shot at the target, I think he did absolutely the best anyone could.

Security guard did not have gun out till 2 people were shot. I call that slow, YMMV.

 

[Renegade]

It also seems the fact the shooter got up when nobody should be getting up (as opposed to when communion is distributed), allowed all the attention to be focused on him. It looked like Security Guard was watching him whole time.

 

[Rhino]

Second guy was too close to the shooter to react and appeared to be unarmed.

Dunno. Seems like he could have almost swatted that shotgun down if he'd lunged. Hard to know how one will react, though, if they've never been under that kind of stress.

 

[majormadmax]

Seemed the gun was way back and hard to get to.

Which is a way many people conceal carry. It's obvious he was also having trouble getting past his clothing to get to the weapon.

No such thing as too close to react. He was textbook condition white and had no clue what was happening or what to do.

The shooter caught him off-guard, and at that range his only option would have been to charge the shooter, but that's an unnatural act for most people when confronted by a lethal threat. Despite the bold comments of many on here, I strongly believe most of us (myself included) couldn't done any better outside of their own pure fantasies!

Security guard did not have gun out till 2 people were shot. I call that slow, YMMV.

OK, Bobby Badass, his draw was a little slow but he had to contend with a lot of panicking people between him and the shooter, and he never took his eyes off the shooter. He also hit him on the first shot at a fair distance against a moving target. I doubt you would have done any better.

 

[majormadmax]

It also seems the fact the shooter got up when nobody should be getting up (as opposed to when communion is distributed), allowed all the attention to be focused on him. It looked like Security Guard was watching him whole time.

Wow, you're quite the Monday Morning Quarterback! I really can't wait to see how well you will react if you ever find yourself in such circumstances!

 

[Renegade]

The shooter caught him off-guard,

Yes that is why it is called condition white.

OK, Bobby Badass, his draw was a little slow but he had to contend with a lot of panicking people between him and the shooter, and he never took his eyes off the shooter. He also hit him on the first shot at a fair distance against a moving target. I doubt you would have done any better.

LOL. Instead of observing what happened with an eye to learn from it, lets make it personal and call folks names and then claim they could not have done better. So helpful....

 

[jrbfishn]

Given how crowded the place was, the best thing the guard probably could have done was to take the time necessary to aim properly and take a single shot.

ALWAYS strive to make the first shot count. You may not get a second.
At least the shooter did not get a third.

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[oldag]

The first guy shot did seem to have trouble clearing his clothing.

However, that was one very brave man. He knew full well he was going to be shot and he kept trying to draw. I know some on this board don't think that kind of bravery exists, but it does. And he displayed it. He has my admiration.

 

[Renegade]

Wow, you're quite the Monday Morning Quarterback!

Actually it is still Sunday afternoon.

And yes, I QB every shooting I see to learn from it. Hopefully I will not need it, but this one should make EVERYONE re-think how quickly they can draw. First guy clearly knew what needed to be done, but could not get gun out in time.

 

[jrbfishn]

Less than 5 minutes since I saw the video. Already gone.


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[Renegade]

The first guy shot did seem to have trouble clearing his clothing.

However, that was one very brave man. He knew full well he was going to be shot and he kept trying to draw. I know some on this board don't think that kind of bravery exists, but it does. And he displayed it. He has my admiration.

Yep, he seemed to be first to see, understand threat and take action. He was just in a bad set of circumstances (seated, close), to be able to effectively get it done.

 

[Dad_Roman]

Less than 5 minutes since I saw the video. Already gone.

PM me your email.

 

[Renegade]

Here is view from another Sunday Afternoon Quarterback:

He says 1st guy had 3.1 seconds to draw, and second guy had 5.3 seconds. Estimated distance at 12-15 yards.

 

[gdr_11]

this link is still active:

https://livestreamfails.com/post/69494

 

[gdr_11]

Monday morning quarterbacking aside, the response seemed to be about as good as could be expected given the action took place at an extreme corner of the sanctuary where only a small number of folks could see the few seconds leading up to the first shot.

Given the element of surprise, stopping the gunman from firing the first shot would have been improbable at best. When your attention is focused on the pastor, it takes time for your brain to process what is going on in an event like this. To their credit, the parishioners reacted quickly and effectively. Unfortunately for the victims, they were in the wrong place and became first on the shooter's list.

 

[Rhino]

Dan Patrick speaking some good words right now. That's good to hear...

https://twitter.com/KABBFOX29/status/1211436750813433856

 

[rman]

Just found out the Catholic Diocese of Fort Worth took down all the 30.06/30.07 signs after Sutherland Springs. They "maintain" a no gun policy, whatever that means. How do you enforce 30.06 without a sign?

Anyhow, I noticed the signs were gone last year but didn't think much into it.

The politics of the Vatican really interfere with my Catholic faith... if that makes sense.

Sent from my SIG Sauer

 

[Dad_Roman]

Video still up at the Church Site...

https://twitter.com/search?q=west freeway church of christ&src=typd