HD Shotgun

[Mexican_Hippie]

I've been thinking through this. If you want a siamese hybrid you get the masterkey. If you want the illegitimate spawn of an AK and a 870 you get the Saiga 12.

Not sure what ARs would mate with.

 

[M. Sage]

The Masterkey isn't actually a weapon, it's a breaching tool.

 

[fenster700]

Where to begin, oh I got it. OP you are on the right path getting suggestions and opinions. If you are dead set on shotgun for HD then get it. My with and I have Mossberg 500's 12ga, yes his and hers. I came with a pistol grip but we invested in the Knoxx adjustable stock. So if you have a significant other they can get a good LOP. Well rather than explain it check it out... Blackhawk Knoxx Stocks they also have pistol grips with the recoil reduction. I love it, shoot all day and don't feel a thing. I have shot it one handed, as if it were a pistol grip and there really was not a problem with it at all. For the record I am 6ft and about 185. I'm no body builder. My wife loves hers too, 5'5" by the way. Thing is I did a little "research" and by that I mean walking around with the "shottie" in the house and treating as a pistol grip and I was somewhat surprised at how easy it was to maneuver. It shoots from the hip with ease. Sure, to handle it as a pistol grip it takes a lil practice to maneuver it with the stock but IMO it is the best of both worlds. As far as capacity goes, isn't that why we own other firearms? as backups?

 

[M. Sage]

Where to begin, oh I got it. OP you are on the right path getting suggestions and opinions. If you are dead set on shotgun for HD then get it. My with and I have Mossberg 500's 12ga, yes his and hers. I came with a pistol grip but we invested in the Knoxx adjustable stock. So if you have a significant other they can get a good LOP. Well rather than explain it check it out... Blackhawk Knoxx Stocks they also have pistol grips with the recoil reduction. I love it, shoot all day and don't feel a thing. I have shot it one handed, as if it were a pistol grip and there really was not a problem with it at all. For the record I am 6ft and about 185. I'm no body builder. My wife loves hers too, 5'5" by the way. Thing is I did a little "research" and by that I mean walking around with the "shottie" in the house and treating as a pistol grip and I was somewhat surprised at how easy it was to maneuver. It shoots from the hip with ease. Sure, to handle it as a pistol grip it takes a lil practice to maneuver it with the stock but IMO it is the best of both worlds. As far as capacity goes, isn't that why we own other firearms? as backups?

Good post.

I'd go with the Mesa kit. You can get a recoil reducing version from them now. I can't say how well that works, but the Mesa kit is better for two reasons. First, the stock tube is parallel with the barrel. I ran into cheek weld issues with my Knoxx, so I took it off. The LOP adjustment turned into a sight alignment adjustment for me... It was pretty pointless with a standard bead, but would have worked alright with some kind of higher sight, like an Aimpoint... Second, the Mesa kit uses a standard AR stock. With the Knoxx kit, you're stuck with the one that comes on it.

One other complaint I have with the Knoxx is that if you shoot with an aggressive posture (like I tend to), and your cheek weld is forward off the stock section and on the tube, the tube recoils back and smashes you in the face hard. I got punched in the teeth by that stock a few times before I realized what it was doing wrong. The recoil buffer on the Mesa stock looks like it won't suffer from that problem, because shotgun recoils toward the tube, instead of the tube moving with the shotgun.

I do think the Mesa kit might be more expensive. I haven't researched it that much.

For a home defense shotgun, I'd go with old-school recoil reduction and just run a 20 gauge (even though yes, my shotgun is a 12 gauge). Recoil is much more manageable, the shotguns are usually a bit lighter, and you're not really giving anything up in terms of the damage it'll do to a person at close range. I really wish that 16 gauge wasn't so hard to find, I think it's the perfect compromise caliber for a HD shotgun - lighter recoil than the 12 gauge, bigger payload than the 20.

At the end of the day, I think the recoil reducing stocks aren't needed. Learn and practice proper form and you'll hardly notice the recoil. I've got an animated .gif of me doing rapid fire with my 870 (standard-style stock, but I think it's a reduced length of pull) somewhere on here... I should get some video of how it's done and post it sometime.

One other thing to factor in is that IMO a straight stock is easier to shoot from the hip than a pistol grip. You don't have your wrist bent at an extreme angle with the straight stock.

 

[poolingmyignorance]

Okay, I'm a bit biased. But thats because I know how to make them work. Saiga shotties. My wife has the 410 with folding stock, it's overall 26" with an 18.25" barrle and holds a "limited" 15 rnds. Out of hundreds of rounds of 3" magnum 00buck it's never failed. Think it's ineffective? Stand infront of one. Missing? With the spread on that thing? Works like this, grab the foregirp hit the light, anything lit up gets some pellets in it. I've got a S12, with a "limited" 20rnds of 2 3/4" 00 buck. Does it ever jam? No. Not even cheap shit fired from the hip.....
That said, a mossy pump, remmy 870, benelli any 12er will do. Practice with it. Don't buy the "you can't train effectivly with it" BS. Show me a range that lets you rapid fire your hand gun, but not your shot gun. Cause most places won't allow EITHER. I can't believe somebody even tried to argue this. What article did he read? Put down your solider of fortune magazine and pick up a gun. Go practice, try shooting somethings other than paper, and see if you still think a shotgun isn't an obviously better choice.
I do AGREE about the racking a shell in. But consider this...now they know your armed know what room your in....but IT's YOUR house, hopefully dark, and you know the layout, and are far less likely to miss. Lets face it criminals don't choose to be low lifes cause they enjoy a challenge. It's cause they want easy prey/money. Chances are they aren't expecting much of a fight, now they KNOW they've got one. Could turn ugly, but in those cases it was probably going to anyway.

 

[Angered_Kabar]

I don't really have anyone/anything important or very expensive outside of my room. If someone breaks in for whatever reason I'm barricading myself in my room but I'm gonna hoot and holler at them to GTFO, I have a gun, etc. I'm figuring if it's just a cat burglar they'll freak and split. Sucks that they'll get to live to be a criminal tomorrow, but oh well. If it's someone with more malicious intent, I'd rather have them come to me.

Absolutely practice clearing house, but if your situation allows, staying in your room covering the door is a valid and effective tactic.

 

[poolingmyignorance]

I don't really have anyone/anything important or very expensive outside of my room. If someone breaks in for whatever reason I'm barricading myself in my room but I'm gonna hoot and holler at them to GTFO, I have a gun, etc. I'm figuring if it's just a cat burglar they'll freak and split. Sucks that they'll get to live to be a criminal tomorrow, but oh well. If it's someone with more malicious intent, I'd rather have them come to me.

Absolutely practice clearing house, but if your situation allows, staying in your room covering the door is a valid and effective tactic.

Well put. I tell my wife the same thing. Take the gun head to the kids room, lock the door and crouch on the floor with the lights off. Let them have the rest the house..oh and most importantly CALL THE COPS, while your in there!

 

[TheDan]

For a home defense shotgun, I'd go with old-school recoil reduction and just run a 20 gauge...
At the end of the day, I think the recoil reducing stocks aren't needed...
One other thing to factor in is that IMO a straight stock is easier to shoot from the hip than a pistol grip. You don't have your wrist bent at an extreme angle with the straight stock.

What he said...

 

[Nasa]

18 inches of barrel and 26 inches over all, you don't need any papers in Texas. This is in fact Texas Gun Talk.
Want a pistol grip. The Knoxx recoil reducing pistol grip is nice.

My number 2 shotgun is a Mossberg 835 with a +5 extension making it a 10 +1, has a Knoxx Blackhawk recoil reducing Spec-Ops stock, quick point red/blue sight, tri-rail with laser and light, a Limbsaver butt pad that makes it shoot like a marshmallow gun. Still have the 28 inch vented rib over bored barrel on it so I can detatch the laser and light and use it for hunting. If hunting for migratory birds, have to swap the spring and take off the extension and put the dowel rod in. Not much chance of that.

My number 1 shotgun is a Maverick 88 with only a 5+1 magazine, 18.5 inch cylinder bore barrel with ATI top folding stock modified to close on top of an Aimtech saddle mount rail, with laser and light mounted to a tri-rail with a heat shield. Next mod to it will be an addition of a Limbsaver butt pad and another modification to the ATI top folder to accommodate latching closed with the Limbsaver.

My number 3 is a Rossi single shot .410 for charming snakes around the place when I'm working outback.

If I had deep pockets, I might have something completely different.

 

[M. Sage]

Well put. I tell my wife the same thing. Take the gun head to the kids room, lock the door and crouch on the floor with the lights off. Let them have the rest the house..oh and most importantly CALL THE COPS, while your in there!

This. Protect your family, forget the rest.

When it comes down to it, tactics are more important than tools. I don't care if you use a bolt action rifle, this kind of scenario puts you at a huge advantage.

 

[Mikewood]

This. Protect your family, forget the rest.

When it comes down to it, tactics are more important than tools. I don't care if you use a bolt action rifle, this kind of scenario puts you at a huge advantage.

Sorry but I think that is incorrect. Tactics are important but so is training a proper weapon and armor. you need all four and a good bit of luck to win. You should plan on repelling such a force and not underestimating your adversary.

I also think telling someone to run to the kids room is a mistake. If you need to move you should do so using proper cover and tactics. Use cover and clear the house from your room to theirs then clear their room and them. can your wife do that with a shotgun, tax light and having a phone? How long does it take her to find the phone? Load the gun? Then start clearing? When she breaks into the kids room gun at low ready are the kids trained not to rush her and trap or pin the gun to her body? Once she's in the room can she lock or bar it? A simple wooden shim can be driven into the door jamb with the butt of a gun to "lock the door".

Speaking of tactics How about a decorative jar of glass beads in a glass vase at the top of a wooden staircase she can knock over to make comming up the sstairs treacherous. There are hundreds of tactics and tricks you can use to do in your house that take a second to set but take minutes to resolve.

 

[M. Sage]

Just dropping a laundry hamper on the stairs is enough to slow someone down significantly. It doesn't take a whole lot to make someone pause on a stairway...

I stand by my statement that tactics are more important than tools. I'll take a .22 and a plan over a SAW and no plan (though the SAW would be pretty sweet...)

There is almost zero cover inside the average home. Including the home itself. I can think of one thing (besides body armor) inside my house that I'd bet on stopping a bullet - the fireplace downstairs. Nothing else - computer desk, bed, couch, any of my chairs, tables - will stop a bullet. None of it. If someone put a round through my front wall downstairs, I guarantee it would still be lethal when it got to the back yard.

 

[ROGER4314]

I'm partial to the Remington 870 and 1100 shotguns and have some fixed up for defense use. The pistol grip 870 looks ugly and cool but I actually fired mine and found the recoil punishing to my right hand. In fact, I quit shooting the 870 pistol grips with anything but low brass bird shot. I dropped the pistol grips in favor of a top folder stock. The side folders work but they make it difficult to rack the action when folded. The top folder stock is not in the way.

The extended magazines are also cool looking but they caused trouble feeding even after trying different brands. I now use only stock, factory length magazines. If extra rounds are required, reloading is easy.

The HD 870 with the top folder, is loaded with 00 buck 2 3/4 magnums. You can do what you want but the recoil of 3" magnums is just not OK and I won't use them. That goes double for the 3 1/2" magnums. My hands are large and the fingers get split wide open on the trigger guard from firing the 3" shells.

Flash

 

[M. Sage]

Huh, you had trouble with mag extensions? I've got a Remington magazine extension that came with a spring (+3 extension), it works flawlessly. Did yours not come with a spring?

 

[Nasa]

I have seen people shot with rifle, pistol and shotguns in my life and from what I have seen my last choice if I got to choose what I was to be shot with would be a shotgun. I have seen bullets penetrate and come out the other side with out inflicting much damage but the shot gun, one had his arm shot off and the other two were fatalities both from a single shot each. A shotgun at close range rips a lot of flesh. Hope I'm never again in a situation to witness any of this again. I'm not saying that bullets are not lethal. It's all a combination of what you are shooting, aiming and hitting the target. The only time I have seen a shotgun to be ineffective is when there is too much distance. When you are shooting more than 75 yards, I would hardly call that home defense. Just my 2 cents.

 

[ls1matt]

Can't go wrong with the mossberg 500. I'm a little bias though..

 

[Portals]

Is that a Knoxx stock?
Which one?
Do you recommend it?

 

[M. Sage]

Is that a Knoxx stock?
Which one?
Do you recommend it?

That looks like the Knoxx NRS. I have a recoil reducing version sitting in the closet. I didn't like it.

Learn how to handle a shotgun properly and it doesn't hurt.

 

[Buckles]

That looks like the Knoxx NRS. I have a recoil reducing version sitting in the closet. I didn't like it.

Learn how to handle a shotgun properly and it doesn't hurt.

if its for an 870 and you ever wanna get rid of it, let me know

 

[M. Sage]

if its for an 870 and you ever wanna get rid of it, let me know

It is, but someone else has called dibs. I'll let you know if he changes his mind.