Re: Your opions on a Kimber please.
Ah'm gonna let ya live fer now............
heretic!
Ah'm gonna let ya live fer now............
heretic!
Your opinions on a Kimber please.
- Thread starter Waterguy
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texas_teacher
Well-Known
Re: Your opions on a Kimber please.
I've shot a few Kimbers and liked them, very accurate, but I also have heard negative reviews of the newer models and that the older models are more reliable.
I've shot a few Kimbers and liked them, very accurate, but I also have heard negative reviews of the newer models and that the older models are more reliable.
Re: Your opions on a Kimber please.
Funny - you seem to hear that on everything - the "new stuff" is crud, etc. My oldest Kimber is a Clackamas, the newest about 2 years old. Frankly, I don't see any real differences.
Funny - you seem to hear that on everything - the "new stuff" is crud, etc. My oldest Kimber is a Clackamas, the newest about 2 years old. Frankly, I don't see any real differences.
Re: Your opions on a Kimber please.
I think Kimbers are fine. Best 1911 for the buck? don't know about that but I don't think they are overpriced. All that said, my opinion for what it's worth, is any sub commander sized 1911 in 45 ACP is going to more problematic than larger sized 1911's. You can get lucky and have one that shoots everything perfectly, but that's not always the case.
I think Kimbers are fine. Best 1911 for the buck? don't know about that but I don't think they are overpriced. All that said, my opinion for what it's worth, is any sub commander sized 1911 in 45 ACP is going to more problematic than larger sized 1911's. You can get lucky and have one that shoots everything perfectly, but that's not always the case.
Re: Your opions on a Kimber please.
ive known three people who owned kimbers. i personally saw all three fail a few times. they all sold them because of reliability issues. i would never buy one but that is just me. my old RIA run perfect and since then i feel no need to spend 700-1000 dollars on a base 1911.
ive known three people who owned kimbers. i personally saw all three fail a few times. they all sold them because of reliability issues. i would never buy one but that is just me. my old RIA run perfect and since then i feel no need to spend 700-1000 dollars on a base 1911.
Re: Your opions on a Kimber please.
I'm kinda lukewarm on Kimbers ... I've seen some have issues and others run fine. Most of the issues with them seem to be related to user error and failure to maintain. People do tend to think the world of them when they really are a middle of the road manufacturer, but I've owned one in the past and think they are a viable option for someone looking for a range toy.
I'm kinda lukewarm on Kimbers ... I've seen some have issues and others run fine. Most of the issues with them seem to be related to user error and failure to maintain. People do tend to think the world of them when they really are a middle of the road manufacturer, but I've owned one in the past and think they are a viable option for someone looking for a range toy.
Re: Your opions on a Kimber please.
I got my Kimber (Pro Carry II) used. It was unreliable from the start, which is probably why it was for sale. This is my first 1911 and I was clueless so I hit the forums. After some research I got a new recoil spring from Wolff and new mags from Checkmate. If the original owner had done this it would still be in his hands. This gun shoots better than I do.
I know the 3" Kimbers seem to have more trouble than my 4", but I think with a little well thought out repairs you can solve most problems you may run into.
Buy it and have fun getting it perfect.
I don't know why Kimber includes such sh**y mags with their guns but it's an easy fix. Recently I bought a Tripp Research spring and follower and installed them in my factory Kimber mag. I ran 200 rounds through it last weekend without a hiccup and it was cheaper than a whole new mag.
I got my Kimber (Pro Carry II) used. It was unreliable from the start, which is probably why it was for sale. This is my first 1911 and I was clueless so I hit the forums. After some research I got a new recoil spring from Wolff and new mags from Checkmate. If the original owner had done this it would still be in his hands. This gun shoots better than I do.
I know the 3" Kimbers seem to have more trouble than my 4", but I think with a little well thought out repairs you can solve most problems you may run into.
Buy it and have fun getting it perfect.
I don't know why Kimber includes such sh**y mags with their guns but it's an easy fix. Recently I bought a Tripp Research spring and follower and installed them in my factory Kimber mag. I ran 200 rounds through it last weekend without a hiccup and it was cheaper than a whole new mag.
texas_teacher
Well-Known
Re: Your opions on a Kimber please.
It's interesting to think about the reliability of these pistols in reference to the mags that are used with them.
It's interesting to think about the reliability of these pistols in reference to the mags that are used with them.
San Antone RR
Well-Known
Re: Your opions on a Kimber please.
You're only as strong as your weakest link. Lots of times it is the mags and springs in 1911s.
Re: Your opions on a Kimber please.
I read a lot of stuff on a variety of sites regarding problems and unreliability of 3" barrel 1911's, and commanders to a lesser extent. I wonder how many of those making the comments have ever owned, or even fired one. I have 2 Kimber .45's - an ultra (3") and a pro (4"), not to mention a SA Officer's. I've got 600+ rounds through each - at least 100 of which each were JHP's - and not one hiccup with any. I own 5 Glocks and have had at least one malfunction with each one during the break-in. I suppose those propagating the negative rumors about sub 5" barrel 1911's forgot to tell mine (including my 3 commanders as well) that they were inferior products.
Patrick Sweeney (Guns & Ammo) tested a Kimber Ultra CDP II (3") a few months back (in the fall, I think). He put several hundred rounds downrange with it - brand new - and shockingly, no malfunctions with his either. He fired 2" groups at 25 yards with a variety of ammo, JHP's included, which is not only astounding, but close to the tolerances that many custom 1911 makers guarantee on their government 1911's. I suppose that pistol didn't get the memo that it sucked either. I would suggest reading that article to anyone considering a Kimber Ultra. Of course he's not going to crap on a pistol produced by a major advertiser in his magazine, but it's easy enough to read between the lines to determine whether or not he really thinks the weapon he's testing is of good quality. This is one of the most positive reviews I've ever read by him. I'm not surprised as mine has performed in the same exemplary fashion, as has that of every other Kimber Ultra owner I know, which is quite a few.
I read a lot of stuff on a variety of sites regarding problems and unreliability of 3" barrel 1911's, and commanders to a lesser extent. I wonder how many of those making the comments have ever owned, or even fired one. I have 2 Kimber .45's - an ultra (3") and a pro (4"), not to mention a SA Officer's. I've got 600+ rounds through each - at least 100 of which each were JHP's - and not one hiccup with any. I own 5 Glocks and have had at least one malfunction with each one during the break-in. I suppose those propagating the negative rumors about sub 5" barrel 1911's forgot to tell mine (including my 3 commanders as well) that they were inferior products.
Patrick Sweeney (Guns & Ammo) tested a Kimber Ultra CDP II (3") a few months back (in the fall, I think). He put several hundred rounds downrange with it - brand new - and shockingly, no malfunctions with his either. He fired 2" groups at 25 yards with a variety of ammo, JHP's included, which is not only astounding, but close to the tolerances that many custom 1911 makers guarantee on their government 1911's. I suppose that pistol didn't get the memo that it sucked either. I would suggest reading that article to anyone considering a Kimber Ultra. Of course he's not going to crap on a pistol produced by a major advertiser in his magazine, but it's easy enough to read between the lines to determine whether or not he really thinks the weapon he's testing is of good quality. This is one of the most positive reviews I've ever read by him. I'm not surprised as mine has performed in the same exemplary fashion, as has that of every other Kimber Ultra owner I know, which is quite a few.
Re: Your opions on a Kimber please.
IMO:
The two Kimber's that I think are worth the money are the basic model, and the TLE.
Many others often are only cosmetically different, yet beg much higher prices.
The TLE offers they best price for front-strap checkering and tritium sights.
IMO:
The two Kimber's that I think are worth the money are the basic model, and the TLE.
Many others often are only cosmetically different, yet beg much higher prices.
The TLE offers they best price for front-strap checkering and tritium sights.
Re: Your opions on a Kimber please.
Own 8 Kimbers....any of which I'll carry without concern about reliability. Havin' said that, I seldom do, simply because I happen to have others that I like a tad better (little smaller, bit better trigger, etc....). To me, it's like anything else - we're gonna each have our preferences. Me, ah'm just happy there's SO many choices!
Own 8 Kimbers....any of which I'll carry without concern about reliability. Havin' said that, I seldom do, simply because I happen to have others that I like a tad better (little smaller, bit better trigger, etc....). To me, it's like anything else - we're gonna each have our preferences. Me, ah'm just happy there's SO many choices!
Re: Your opions on a Kimber please.
I've owned Kimber, shot probably 50 different models, and sold over a 100 of them, and seen 1000 of them on the firing line with shooters of various skill and abilities. I can say unequivocally that the 3" guns are the worst in terms of reliability. It doesn't even have to be a Kimber, I've seen SA, Colt, Wilson Combat, etc. have issues in the 3". The 4.25" Commander guns are better in the Kimber line, but they still don't hold up to the 5" guns in terms of reliability.
When you get 50% more spring in the gun it is very sensitive to any kind of flinch or a poor grip, and combine that with the fact that all 1911s need to be lubricated and you get 50% of the 1911 owners out there having issues on the firing line. The 1911 is not a beginners gun ... it needs maintenance and it needs competency.
I've owned Kimber, shot probably 50 different models, and sold over a 100 of them, and seen 1000 of them on the firing line with shooters of various skill and abilities. I can say unequivocally that the 3" guns are the worst in terms of reliability. It doesn't even have to be a Kimber, I've seen SA, Colt, Wilson Combat, etc. have issues in the 3". The 4.25" Commander guns are better in the Kimber line, but they still don't hold up to the 5" guns in terms of reliability.
When you get 50% more spring in the gun it is very sensitive to any kind of flinch or a poor grip, and combine that with the fact that all 1911s need to be lubricated and you get 50% of the 1911 owners out there having issues on the firing line. The 1911 is not a beginners gun ... it needs maintenance and it needs competency.
Re: Your opions on a Kimber please.
Texas1911: thanks for the insight. I take that to mean, and I hope I'm not paraphrasing incorrectly, that 3" barrel 1911's, and not peculiar to just Kimber, are not necessarily inferior products because of their size, but simply the most prone to malfunction if not maintained or handled properly? That makes perfect sense to me and is a different tale than that told by many 3" 1911 haters. It's also been my observation that range players in general take crappy care of their weapons (even dealers - I once had one that told me not to even bother cleaning a new commander I bought from him until I had 2000 rounds through it - yes that's thousand, not hundred...just disgraceful). There must be some disconnect. I do not have the experience with these weapons that you described above, but it can't be coincidence that the significant experience that I have had, as well as that of many others who I know and who have weighed in, has been very different and very positive.
Texas1911: thanks for the insight. I take that to mean, and I hope I'm not paraphrasing incorrectly, that 3" barrel 1911's, and not peculiar to just Kimber, are not necessarily inferior products because of their size, but simply the most prone to malfunction if not maintained or handled properly? That makes perfect sense to me and is a different tale than that told by many 3" 1911 haters. It's also been my observation that range players in general take crappy care of their weapons (even dealers - I once had one that told me not to even bother cleaning a new commander I bought from him until I had 2000 rounds through it - yes that's thousand, not hundred...just disgraceful). There must be some disconnect. I do not have the experience with these weapons that you described above, but it can't be coincidence that the significant experience that I have had, as well as that of many others who I know and who have weighed in, has been very different and very positive.
Re: Your opions on a Kimber please.
The 3" guns are always going to be more finicky than the 5" guns, it's just physical fact, but properly maintained, with good magazines, and proper usage the guns should fulfill their job just fine. The issue is the springs are so heavy and the slide has been reduced in mass significantly. The guns are oversprung to avoid frame battering (and eventually cracking of the slide / frame), and that just doesn't give the nice long period of time for extraction and feeding.
Accuracy wise, the only thing that makes them less accurate than the bigger guns is the reduction in sight radius. You could take a 3", 4.25", and 5" gun and shoot fist sized holes at 10 yards all day. Once the bullet is stable the barrel length isn't a big deal as you're just gaining velocity ... however the bushing guns have better lock-up and fit than the bull guns.
The 3" guns are always going to be more finicky than the 5" guns, it's just physical fact, but properly maintained, with good magazines, and proper usage the guns should fulfill their job just fine. The issue is the springs are so heavy and the slide has been reduced in mass significantly. The guns are oversprung to avoid frame battering (and eventually cracking of the slide / frame), and that just doesn't give the nice long period of time for extraction and feeding.
Accuracy wise, the only thing that makes them less accurate than the bigger guns is the reduction in sight radius. You could take a 3", 4.25", and 5" gun and shoot fist sized holes at 10 yards all day. Once the bullet is stable the barrel length isn't a big deal as you're just gaining velocity ... however the bushing guns have better lock-up and fit than the bull guns.
tanlover442
New Member
Re: Your opions on a Kimber please.
Kimber is well known for quality firearms. Sometimes a little tweaking will make a good gun lots better. Springs and clips make a big difference.
Kimber is well known for quality firearms. Sometimes a little tweaking will make a good gun lots better. Springs and clips make a big difference.
Re: Your opions on a Kimber please.
Actually I bought the extra mags because the Kimber only came with one. Got a good deal on the Wilson's so that's what I went with.
Actually I bought the extra mags because the Kimber only came with one. Got a good deal on the Wilson's so that's what I went with.
Mexican_Hippie
TGT Addict
Re: Your opions on a Kimber please.
Hey Waterguy, I have a Ultra Covert (3" Kimber) and it runs great. I use the KimPro TacMags with it.
When it comes to these, I'd buy one with a few hundred rounds through it that hasn't malfunctioned rather than a brand new one. It's already tested for you. My advice would be to shoot it (with JHPs) and check it out thoroughly. These 3" seem to have some slip through that aren't quite 100% from the factory because the tolerances have to be so much more accurate on the smaller ones. My brother had an issue with his and it turned out to be just the factory mag though. If it shoots good and you like it then it's just down to pricing.
Hey Waterguy, I have a Ultra Covert (3" Kimber) and it runs great. I use the KimPro TacMags with it.
When it comes to these, I'd buy one with a few hundred rounds through it that hasn't malfunctioned rather than a brand new one. It's already tested for you. My advice would be to shoot it (with JHPs) and check it out thoroughly. These 3" seem to have some slip through that aren't quite 100% from the factory because the tolerances have to be so much more accurate on the smaller ones. My brother had an issue with his and it turned out to be just the factory mag though. If it shoots good and you like it then it's just down to pricing.
Re: Your opions on a Kimber please.
When you have people of the caliber such as Ken Hackathorn, Larry Vickers, Hilton Yam, Dean Caputo.......and the list goes on.......people with literally MILLIONS of rounds of experience on the platform over several decades ALL saying the same thing.......I tend to listen to what people like that say. It has also been my personal experience that, with the literally hundreds of different handguns I've shot over the past decade, when it comes to 1911's I have personally seen more problems with the 3" guns than the 5". Probably 6 months to a year ago, I got into this same discussion with someone on another thread here, and they just didn't believe me. Strangely enough, that same week, within a 4 day period at the range I worked, I saw ~14-15 1911's come through, a majority of which were 3" guns, and EVERY single one had failures of some sort. One of them, a Para Ordnance (there's reasons I don't recommend them), sheared off the ejector and had some other problems. It's just the limitation of the design. Strangely enough, one of the 1911's that had problems was Governor Perry's Colt Defender. I took a look at it for him, lubed it up, and it still wouldn't feed worth a damn.
They have a very fine window of operation when it is cut down to that size. Some of the pros even recommend replacing the 3" gun recoil springs as soon as 500rds, which is a pretty definite indicator of just how particular they can be.
Bottom line, as long as you do a proper function test of your particular gun, run at least 500rds through it IMO, and if you can do that without 1 single failure, then it's probably going to work fine. Just remember, if you run 500+rds through it, you're already coming up close on a recoil spring change. The main reason lots of us recommend against those guns is, in many of our personal experiences (I know I can attest to this for both Alan and I), most people simply do not maintain their guns. A 1911, let alone a potentially finicky 3" 1911 are absolutely not the choice for people like that. I've met a TON of people that own and carry 1911's that really have no business doing so, and that would be better served with a beater Glock. Know your platform, do what you have to do to keep it running, and that's all that really matters in the end. So, we're not really bagging on your choice Danton, just trying to provide some words of wisdom. Do what you gotta do to keep it up and running, and that's all that matters! :-)
When you have people of the caliber such as Ken Hackathorn, Larry Vickers, Hilton Yam, Dean Caputo.......and the list goes on.......people with literally MILLIONS of rounds of experience on the platform over several decades ALL saying the same thing.......I tend to listen to what people like that say. It has also been my personal experience that, with the literally hundreds of different handguns I've shot over the past decade, when it comes to 1911's I have personally seen more problems with the 3" guns than the 5". Probably 6 months to a year ago, I got into this same discussion with someone on another thread here, and they just didn't believe me. Strangely enough, that same week, within a 4 day period at the range I worked, I saw ~14-15 1911's come through, a majority of which were 3" guns, and EVERY single one had failures of some sort. One of them, a Para Ordnance (there's reasons I don't recommend them), sheared off the ejector and had some other problems. It's just the limitation of the design. Strangely enough, one of the 1911's that had problems was Governor Perry's Colt Defender. I took a look at it for him, lubed it up, and it still wouldn't feed worth a damn.
They have a very fine window of operation when it is cut down to that size. Some of the pros even recommend replacing the 3" gun recoil springs as soon as 500rds, which is a pretty definite indicator of just how particular they can be. Bottom line, as long as you do a proper function test of your particular gun, run at least 500rds through it IMO, and if you can do that without 1 single failure, then it's probably going to work fine. Just remember, if you run 500+rds through it, you're already coming up close on a recoil spring change. The main reason lots of us recommend against those guns is, in many of our personal experiences (I know I can attest to this for both Alan and I), most people simply do not maintain their guns. A 1911, let alone a potentially finicky 3" 1911 are absolutely not the choice for people like that. I've met a TON of people that own and carry 1911's that really have no business doing so, and that would be better served with a beater Glock. Know your platform, do what you have to do to keep it running, and that's all that really matters in the end. So, we're not really bagging on your choice Danton, just trying to provide some words of wisdom. Do what you gotta do to keep it up and running, and that's all that matters! :-)
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