When do you think China is going to invade and take Taiwan ?

[Wolfwood]

I don't disagree with your overall point but you've got this one wrong. The Chinese navy isn't equipped to project any real power more than 1000 miles from port. They're trying to build it but it will be decades before they could secure the entire trade route to the Middle East.

Right now, the Japanese could completely kick their ass.

I take solace in the fact that if China invaded Taiwan, the U.S. could utterly humiliate them in a hot war.

That is, if we have the will, the leadership, and the courage.

And that's a big "if."

It would be nice to see Japan push in china's shit for good.

 

[baboon]

As far as I'm concerned, if it aint Szechuan it ain't really Chinese...

What’s wrong with Mandarin, Cantonese, Shandong?

 

[wiredgeorge]

Our secret weapon will be Hunter. Send him in to negotiate a surrender of Taiwan aka Nationalist China and both he and "the big guy" can make a quick buck. They couldn't send our military over there anyway as I think they are in a month long stand down to digest CRT.

 

[SA_Steve]

1/Taiwan is where all the chips are made. A China takeover would be interesting. Still make them, but at a higher price?

2/Chinese employment would drop a lot if the U.S. quit being their customer. (But neither country would do well without the other).

3/ After ALL the U.S. military adventures since WWII, very few successful or smart, no one has any desire for a killing war on the other side of the planet.

4/ Whatever China/Russia has planned, now is the time.

 

[baboon]

Our secret weapon will be Hunter. Send him in to negotiate a surrender of Taiwan aka Nationalist China and both he and "the big guy" can make a quick buck. They couldn't send our military over there anyway as I think they are in a month long stand down to digest CRT.

Sending Hunter and the chicoms will turn him into a lethal STD, that Fauchi has never seen!

 

[glenbo]

I do like a good Chinese buffet.

Sesame chicken!

Meow chow mein.

 

[45tex]

As I think on this subject, I don't think China needs to show power right now.
They own vast amounts of American land and have control of much of our government. Nike and the NBA exist to promote China. They are better off with us able to pay our foreign debt right now .
Taiwan can't get bigger or more powerful. They can stew for the time being.

 

[oldag]

I don't disagree with your overall point but you've got this one wrong. The Chinese navy isn't equipped to project any real power more than 1000 miles from port. They're trying to build it but it will be decades before they could secure the entire trade route to the Middle East.

Right now, the Japanese could completely kick their ass.

I take solace in the fact that if China invaded Taiwan, the U.S. could utterly humiliate them in a hot war.

That is, if we have the will, the leadership, and the courage.

And that's a big "if."

They would be fighting pirates according to your scenario, not anyone's Navy. Does not require a sophisticated fleet.

Chinese Navy (and they are still building as fast as they can)

• Aircraft carriers - 2
• Landing helicopter docks - 2
• Amphibious transport docks - 8
• Landing ship tanks - 32
• Landing ship medium - 33
• Ballistic missile submarines - 7
• Nuclear attack submarines - 12
• Attack submarines (SSK) - 60
• Destroyers - 50
• Frigates - 49
• Corvettes - 71
• Missile boats - 109
• Submarine chasers - 94
• Gunboats - 17
• Mine countermeasures vessels - 36
• Replenishment oilers - 19
• Auxiliaries (various) - 233

 

[benenglish]

They would be fighting pirates according to your scenario, not anyone's Navy. Does not require a sophisticated fleet.

Chinese Navy (and they are still building as fast as they can)

• Aircraft carriers - 2
• Landing helicopter docks - 2
• Amphibious transport docks - 8
• Landing ship tanks - 32
• Landing ship medium - 33
• Ballistic missile submarines - 7
• Nuclear attack submarines - 12
• Attack submarines (SSK) - 60
• Destroyers - 50
• Frigates - 49
• Corvettes - 71
• Missile boats - 109
• Submarine chasers - 94
• Gunboats - 17
• Mine countermeasures vessels - 36
• Replenishment oilers - 19
• Auxiliaries (various) - 233

No, they won't be fighting pirates. Many of those pirates would be operating in the Indian ocean, far beyond the range of their navy. The most worrisome pirates would be state actors operating off the Malay peninsula and they can truly control the real choke points through which oil tankers must pass. The Chinese are not going to even try to employ a military solution to that problem and the amount of money they would have to pay to bribe those countries to get their oil would be unfathomable.

That list of naval assets is laughable compared to the U.S. For example, those two aircraft carriers you list? One of them was a surplus hulk that was a floating casino and then converted into an aircraft carrier. The other one isn't much better. Their carriers are small and weak; they were obsolete decades ago. In all the world, I think there are 13 or 14 super-carriers and their battle groups, the sort that can project real power thousands of miles away from home. The United States has 11 of them. 2 U.S. carrier groups could make a complete hash of the Chinese navy in a couple of weeks.

Seriously, the Chinese navy has never been able to break out and project any real power beyond the first island chain. That's as true today as it has been for all of recorded history. They're building ships and trying to change that but they're decades away from anything that might be called even a half-ass global capability.

The Chinese simply cannot ensure their flow of oil in tankers traveling the Indian Ocean. The U.S. Navy, patrolling those waters and making sure shipping lanes are protected, is what enables China to keep the lights on.

If we wanted to, we could turn off the tap in an instant.

I'm not worried, not one little bit, about non-nuclear Chinese military capability. I'm particularly unconcerned with their navy, whether they try to use it against pirates or against the U.S.

I'm worried about whether or not the U.S. has the testicular fortitude to stand up to the Chinese. If we're short in that area, nothing else matters and we lose, Taiwan loses, and the free world loses.

 

[Wiliamr]

Chinese will simply shut down exports to the USA. WHAT????? No iPhones, iPads, etc, , medicines, Nikes, most shoes, no new underwear or socks, Walmarts, Target and computer stores will be empty.

 

[benenglish]

Chinese will simply shut down exports to the USA. WHAT????? No iPhones, iPads, etc, , medicines, Nikes, most shoes, no new underwear or socks, Walmarts, Target and computer stores will be empty.

Yep. And that will hurt, quite badly, for quite a while. But there's nothing the Chinese make that we can't make here in North America. In case people need a reminder, Mexico and Canada would be on our side in all this and our relationships would be very, very mutually beneficial. Heck, if the Chinese were stupid enough to step away from the U.S. market in order to punish us, Mexico would prosper like they never have before. That would be good for everyone.

After a few years of shortages, we'd recover and we'd be stronger than ever.

 

[Wiliamr]

Yep. And that will hurt, quite badly, for quite a while. But there's nothing the Chinese make that we can't make here in North America. In case people need a reminder, Mexico and Canada would be on our side in all this and our relationships would be very, very mutually beneficial. Heck, if the Chinese were stupid enough to step away from the U.S. market in order to punish us, Mexico would prosper like they never have before. That would be good for everyone.

After a few years of shortages, we'd recover and we'd be stronger than ever.

Generally I agree. The main wonderment is the 200 million Americans who are completely dependent on others for their existence and have neither the wit, nor capacity to adapt and overcome. The wailing and gnashing of teeth of those who can not plant food, hunt or fish, nor sew their torn shirt or patch pants let alone figure out how to make due without all the Chicom imports for a year or so will have the socialists just give in to their Chicom patrons.

 

[Mowingmaniac 24/7]

W,

Your opinion of Americans is 'that' low?

My opinion: I hope china does stops using us as their market and we go back to manufacturing all we abandoned like medications and much, much more...

 

[mavs]

W,

Your opinion of Americans is 'that' low?

My opinion: I hope china does stops using us as their market and we go back to manufacturing all we abandoned like medications and much, much more...

We will never do that willingly. it's all about the bucks!

 

[45tex]

The everything Apple is Chinese
Samsung is S. Korea product
Someone else pointed out that most computer chips are from Taiwan
wish.com would dry up. I refer to wish often as looking there you can find so many things that we buy everyday just missing the American company name.
It would be tough and expensive but we could live without China.
Wallyworld would be in dire trouble, and I gotta admit that would make me smile.
In the long run it would be much worse on the Chinese people and this is the fault of communism not the average Chinese citizen that knows nothing else.
Never forget that before WWII China was a great ally of America. That China today is Taiwan. A tiny island of freedom deserving of our support

 

[Wiliamr]

W,

Your opinion of Americans is 'that' low?

My opinion: I hope china does stops using us as their market and we go back to manufacturing all we abandoned like medications and much, much more...

I just know what I see observing Americans as they by and large demonstrate an unhealthy lack of knowledge of the basics of gathering food, farming, etc.

I agree with your hope that the Chicoms stop selling here, but they will not. They are merchants, have been for thousands of years and exporting goods has been their stock in trade for a long time. Think back to Marco Polo.

We have been trained to think of Chinese as ignorant peasants who have no skills other than scratching out some dirt to plant rice for a long time. Remember they invented gunpowder, the compass, paper, silk, an earthquake detector, iron and steel smelting as long ago as 1000 BC.

 

[Zach5065]

I don't think China will do that soon because it is not necessary. Taiwan used to be important for PLA lacks airplane carriers, but now they could control the whole area without controlling Taiwan.

 

[mavs]

I don't think they really have any reason to do it except for the facts that the Biden administration is pathetically weak, and they want to take the opportunity with him in the white house to poke their finger in the eye of the United States.

They are also probably getting really irritated with all of the accusations of the US that they are responsible for killing about 4 million people and practically destroyed the economy of most of the countries in the world.

So, if they are ever going to do it, this is probably the right time.

 

[Axxe55]

I don't think they really have any reason to do it except for the facts that the Biden administration is pathetically weak, and they want to take the opportunity with him in the white house to poke their finger in the eye of the United States.

They are also probably getting really irritated with all of the accusations of the US that they are responsible for killing about 4 million people and practically destroyed the economy of most of the countries in the world.

So, if they are ever going to do it, this is probably the right time.

You really are just naive. Biden has been in bed with the Chinese for years. He has made millions off the Chinese government and business. It doesn't have a flying rat's turd to do with him, or his administration being weak.

Look at all the corruption involving Biden and his son Hunter that has come to surface over the last few years.

You really just haven't the first clue as to what's going on. Just like Gambler didn't.

 

[oldag]

No, they won't be fighting pirates. Many of those pirates would be operating in the Indian ocean, far beyond the range of their navy. The most worrisome pirates would be state actors operating off the Malay peninsula and they can truly control the real choke points through which oil tankers must pass. The Chinese are not going to even try to employ a military solution to that problem and the amount of money they would have to pay to bribe those countries to get their oil would be unfathomable.

That list of naval assets is laughable compared to the U.S. For example, those two aircraft carriers you list? One of them was a surplus hulk that was a floating casino and then converted into an aircraft carrier. The other one isn't much better. Their carriers are small and weak; they were obsolete decades ago. In all the world, I think there are 13 or 14 super-carriers and their battle groups, the sort that can project real power thousands of miles away from home. The United States has 11 of them. 2 U.S. carrier groups could make a complete hash of the Chinese navy in a couple of weeks.

Seriously, the Chinese navy has never been able to break out and project any real power beyond the first island chain. That's as true today as it has been for all of recorded history. They're building ships and trying to change that but they're decades away from anything that might be called even a half-ass global capability.

The Chinese simply cannot ensure their flow of oil in tankers traveling the Indian Ocean. The U.S. Navy, patrolling those waters and making sure shipping lanes are protected, is what enables China to keep the lights on.

If we wanted to, we could turn off the tap in an instant.

I'm not worried, not one little bit, about non-nuclear Chinese military capability. I'm particularly unconcerned with their navy, whether they try to use it against pirates or against the U.S.

I'm worried about whether or not the U.S. has the testicular fortitude to stand up to the Chinese. If we're short in that area, nothing else matters and we lose, Taiwan loses, and the free world loses.

You say they won't be fighting pirates, then you say they will be fighting pirates.

Exactly who do you think would be attacking their oil tankers?

Their navy has been making port calls in parts of the world besides the barrier islands. And they have base agreements with a number of countries.

If the US doesn't step in to stop the invasion of Taiwan (the scenario being discussed here), then what in the heck makes anyone think the US would use naval force to stop their tankers?? The US Navy capability and size is irrelevant when the pres lacks the guts to use it.