What situations are valid to use your right to pull your firearm?

[Dirt]

Obviosly, if someone is coming at you with a knife or pulls a gun but, what else would be valid if you pulled your weapon and shot someone? Is it important to avoid head shots?

I take my chl class on saturday and will ask the same question but couldnt wait since it was already partially brought up, plus this forum will maybe provide more incite than the one instructor can.




(I was going to ask this question in a similar post but feared hijacking.)

 

[TimberWolf7.62]

The instructors I have had have said that the criteria for drawing down on someone is the same as for shooting someone, i.e., you feel your life is threatened and are prepared to shoot. However, I can easily see situations in which you may be able to draw your weapon but still keep it concealed (behind your leg, for example) if a situation seems to be escalating.

 

[jordanmills]

The instructors I have had have said that the criteria for drawing down on someone is the same as for shooting someone, i.e., you feel your life is threatened and are prepared to shoot. However, I can easily see situations in which you may be able to draw your weapon but still keep it concealed (behind your leg, for example) if a situation seems to be escalating.

Hope this is so. A couple of weeks ago I was almost in a fight (managed to keep the hotheads on "my" side cool enough to keep it from being much more than a shouting/bottle throwing match till the popo arrived), was drawn under my jacket praying I wouldn't have to use it. I reckon that's still concealed and not necessarily making a threat.

 

[codygjohnson]

Check out TXInvestigators blog with the CHL laws. Short version would be, don't pull it out unless you truly felt your life was in immediate danger.

I've always figured 4 steps if I was being aggressively approached (as in: I had a good idea that they mean to do harm to me or my family):

1. Make eye contact and demand that the person stop (Hopefully that does it).
2. Place my hand on the backstrap and repeat step one.
3. Draw my weapon and repeat step one.
4. Fire my weapon.

This would all be if I noticed someone approaching me with what I perceived to be aggressive intent. If someone were to attack me or my family without me seeing them first, skip straight to step 4. The idea of shooting someone who is unarmed is totally foreign to me and would be an absolute last resort, but if you are going to keep coming at me with a gun drawn on you, then I guess I’m going to jail.

I would never attempt a headshot. I guess if I was in some sort of action movie and he had my kid hostage a few feet in front of me with a knife to his throat...maybe. Center of mass hits are much simpler under duress. Without constant practice, I would be surprised if you were even aiming when firing at a person within 10 feet. I know when I practice drawing and firing at ranges under 15 feet, I point shoot more than anything, and I practice/train all the time.


Keep in mind that this is not a suggestion as to what you should do, it's just what I do, wrong or not.

 

[ReVrEnD_0341]

The way I see it no matter what the law is, if you draw your weapon someone better be in dire need of getting shot. If this is not the case, keep your weapon holstered and de-escalate the situation.

If I draw my weapon, someone is going to die. If they do not need hot lead ventilation, then the weapon isn't even going to get touched.

 

[Texan2]

If I draw my weapon, someone is going to die.

Thats a scary statement...in the vast majority of cases in which a CHL holder displays a weapon, the attacker stops their aggresive behavior and flees. In which case you would no longer be in danger, in which case you shouldn't kill someone.
Good guy draws+Bad guy puts hands up and quits=Do not shoot

 

[Texas1911]

Thats a scary statement...in the vast majority of cases in which a CHL holder displays a weapon, the attacker stops their aggresive behavior and flees. In which case you would no longer be in danger, in which case you shouldn't kill someone.

Good guy draws+Bad guy puts hands up and quits=Do not shoot

I think it's more or less meant for situational dictation rather than face value.

To back up TexasCop, you can produce your firearm as intent to use deadly force and not use it as a last ditch motivator to control a situation.

§ 9.04. THREATS AS JUSTIFIABLE FORCE. The threat of
force is justified when the use of force is justified by this
chapter. For purposes of this section, a threat to cause death or
serious bodily injury by the production of a weapon or otherwise, as
long as the actor's purpose is limited to creating an apprehension
that he will use deadly force if necessary, does not constitute the
use of deadly force.

There is a large chance that you will be arrested, but it is a viable defense to prosecution.

 

[ftw13]

they'll arrest you for drawing your weapon to protect yourself but not using it once the situation is no longer dangerous? that has to be the most retarded thing ever

 

[Texas1911]

they'll arrest you for drawing your weapon to protect yourself but not using it once the situation is no longer dangerous? that has to be the most retarded thing ever

They can arrest you for anything, and/or charge you with brandishing, etc. but it's up to the courts to decide if anything sticks.

 

[Texan2]

they'll arrest you for drawing your weapon to protect yourself but not using it once the situation is no longer dangerous? that has to be the most retarded thing ever

No, typically if it is a legitimate display of your weapon to defend yourself, you would not get arrested...typically. That is what Ch. 9 explains (see above post)

 

[oldguy]

(What situations are valid to use your right to pull your firearm)


My thought is "last resort"........and at that have a good lawyer,and a fat wallet I'm not saying that is the way it should be but in a society over burdened with lawyers it is the game.

 

[willygene]

ReVrenD your statement is very scary i have carried a gun most of my life and most of that in law enforcement and i would rather draw my weapon and have the problem stopped with out shooting someone. just because their a threat at the time doesn't mean they need to be shot ,if so my self and many officers everywhere would be in bad trouble for doing so, as i have drawn my weapon in the line of duty enough to wear out more than one well made holster and still haven't had to shoot anybody. If you are serious about your statement i don't think you need to be carrying a loaded weapon.

 

[Texas1911]

ReVrenD your statement is very scary i have carried a gun most of my life and most of that in law enforcement and i would rather draw my weapon and have the problem stopped with out shooting someone. just because their a threat at the time doesn't mean they need to be shot ,if so my self and many officers everywhere would be in bad trouble for doing so, as i have drawn my weapon in the line of duty enough to wear out more than one well made holster and still haven't had to shoot anybody. If you are serious about your statement i don't think you need to be carrying a loaded weapon.

Again, he is making a point that the gun doesn't come out until it's a situation that involves shooting. You guys are reading too far into it. He's not driving around looking for a gunfight.

Chuck has been in a gunfight or two, so I don't think he's got any misconceptions about it.

 

[smschulz]

The way I see it no matter what the law is, if you draw your weapon someone better be in dire need of getting shot. If this is not the case, keep your weapon holstered and de-escalate the situation.

If I draw my weapon, someone is going to die. If they do not need hot lead ventilation, then the weapon isn't even going to get touched.

I agree completely.
If you need to pull the gun then you will need to pull the trigger.
Using your weapon as a 'scare tactic' is bad policy, IMO.

Thats a scary statement...in the vast majority of cases in which a CHL holder displays a weapon, the attacker stops their aggresive behavior and flees. In which case you would no longer be in danger, in which case you shouldn't kill someone.
Good guy draws+Bad guy puts hands up and quits=Do not shoot

If this is a scary statement then you shouldn't be carrying.
No one want to shoot but if you carry you must be prepared to use it.
It is a last resort effort....not a next-to-last resort effort to scare.

 

[smschulz]

ReVrenD your statement is very scary i have carried a gun most of my life and most of that in law enforcement and i would rather draw my weapon and have the problem stopped with out shooting someone. just because their a threat at the time doesn't mean they need to be shot ,if so my self and many officers everywhere would be in bad trouble for doing so, as i have drawn my weapon in the line of duty enough to wear out more than one well made holster and still haven't had to shoot anybody. If you are serious about your statement i don't think you need to be carrying a loaded weapon.

As a former LE you should know better.
Don't you think there is a difference in situations to pull a weapon as a Police Officer and having to defend your life as an individual?
It isn't a question of what we would 'rather' do it is a question of what you must do (to survive).
I find the comment about ReVrenD not carrying inappropriate.

 

[ftw13]

i dont want to have to take someones life,if i pull my weapon and they go away fine....if not i will fire. i will do what i can not to have to use it,but am prepared to if necessary.

 

[Texas1911]

Using your weapon as a 'scare tactic' is bad policy, IMO.

If it can be utilized as a defensive measure to avoid deadly force, and used responsibly, then I see no problem with it.

If you are just going out pointing a gun at anyone that get's in your face, then well ... that's not responsible. If a vocal defense fails, and you have little realistic choice, why wait for the situation to become a deadly force incident.

If you can defuse the situation by pulling a firearm, then it's a win:win situation. You are not harmed, the offender is not harmed. The situation was avoided. Do you run a risk of indictment? Sure.

I see the whole "wait until it becomes deadly" situation similar to waiting for the person to throw the first punch. It's a risk.

 

[smschulz]

Carrying is a serious.
Pulling your gun out is more serious.
If you need to pull out your weapon then be prepared to use it.

 

[Texan2]

The way I see it no matter what the law is, if you draw your weapon someone better be in dire need of getting shot. If this is not the case, keep your weapon holstered and de-escalate the situation.

If I draw my weapon, someone is going to die. (emphasis added) If they do not need hot lead ventilation, then the weapon isn't even going to get touched.

I just re-read his post. Perhaps he mis-spoke, perhaps not, but look at the text. I don't think we are reading anything into what he said....he seems to have been very clear about his position.

 

[Texan2]

I agree completely.
If you need to pull the gun then you will need to pull the trigger.
Using your weapon as a 'scare tactic' is bad policy, IMO.


If this is a scary statement then you shouldn't be carrying.
No one want to shoot but if you carry you must be prepared to use it.
It is a last resort effort....not a next-to-last resort effort to scare.

Surely you cant be serious....thinking that someone who proposes everytime you draw your weapon you need to shoot someone is on the right track?

I too, have drawn my weapon countless times and NEVER had to shoot anyone, the mere sight of the weapon provided the motivation for the perpetrator to cease his activity. In no part of my post did I state that I was not ready to use my weapon if neccesary. And yes, if the threat of deadly force solves the problem, then deadly force should not be used. Re-read Chapter 9...

I would have never guessed I would have had to have this discussion with my friends here....