Church Sign Question

[flyrod40]

Our church does not have any 30.05, .06 or .07 signs posted; however, two issues:

1. I remember several years before covid closed our church, the pastor announced at the beginning of the service for three Sundays in a row no guns in church. About one year ago the church moved to a new location several miles away. Does the actual knowledge of the "no-gun" policy apply to the new building, assuming you originally heard it?

2. I recently noticed the 30.05, .06 and .07 notices posted in the Sunday bulletin in very, very small print (not bold either) down at the bottom of one of the pages. Does that prevent someone from carrying in the church? Especially, if you never heard the original policy from probably about four years ago or never saw it in the bulletin?

Thanks in advance. I am anxious to hear everyone's thoughts.

 

[ZX9RCAM]

Well, if it's the same pastor that gave notice, the building doesn't make a difference, does it?
And now you can't claim you never heard it.

 

[toddnjoyce]

Unless a sign is posted per the law, it is not effective. On a handout/flyer isn’t posting per the law.

 

[Otto_Mation]

Sounds like your pastor is inviting wackos in to shoot people unabated. I think that I would look for another church. I would feel much safer if every church member was strapped.

 

[ZX9RCAM]

Unless a sign is posted per the law, it is not effective. On a handout/flyer isn’t posting per the law.

Verbal notice is not sufficient?
Maybe I was thinking about trespassing, lol.
My bad.

 

[alternative]

Unless a sign is posted per the law, it is not effective. On a handout/flyer isn’t posting per the law.

If you receive written notice that is sufficient notice. Find another church.

 

[toddnjoyce]

Verbal notice is not sufficient?
Maybe I was thinking about trespassing, lol.
My bad.

Not verbal notice from years ago. Has to be at given at time of infraction.

 

[Eastexasrick]

Our church does not have any 30.05, .06 or .07 signs posted; however, two issues:

1. I remember several years before covid closed our church, the pastor announced at the beginning of the service for three Sundays in a row no guns in church. About one year ago the church moved to a new location several miles away. Does the actual knowledge of the "no-gun" policy apply to the new building, assuming you originally heard it?

2. I recently noticed the 30.05, .06 and .07 notices posted in the Sunday bulletin in very, very small print (not bold either) down at the bottom of one of the pages. Does that prevent someone from carrying in the church? Especially, if you never heard the original policy from probably about four years ago or never saw it in the bulletin?

Thanks in advance. I am anxious to hear everyone's thoughts.

How about the direct and honest approach? Ask him for a monument of his time. Take time to allow him to explain his feelings and see if he will allow you the time to explain yours. If he finds your position untenable, first he is not a sensible person, second you have options to find another place to worship with like minded individuals. .

 

[toddnjoyce]

If you receive written notice that is sufficient notice. Find another church.

Not effective notice and I’d have a field day in court with this by simply asking can you prove I picked up that bulletin?

But let’s back up the how TPC30.06 really works. A sign is posted and a license holder goes past it. Someone has to get LE involved to write the ticket. Who’s calling the cops and on what grounds, because nobody on staff has the authority to write the citation.

Continuing with that, let’s say a staff member says I’m sorry, but you have to leave. Okay, I leave; no violation.

Wait, the staff says “you’re can’t leave until the cops get here to trespass you.” Nope; illegal detention by the staff member and I relate to the cop that I tried to leave and was detained against my will. Staff member gets arrested.

Just checked the DPS statistics; still zero 30.06 convictions and a grand total of 4 UCW by a license holder convictions.

 

[andre3k]

You attend church there. I would say it's time to have a conversation with the Elders because normally, they would be the decision makers in a church. We have a security ministry at my church, most of them are armed during service and in the parking lot.

Sent from my SM-S918U using Tapatalk

 

[Wudidiz]

I pray that your church never gets a nutcase with an AR.

 

[BigRed]

Commie pastor?

 

[ldaniel]

Our church does not have any 30.05, .06 or .07 signs posted; however, two issues:

1. I remember several years before covid closed our church, the pastor announced at the beginning of the service for three Sundays in a row no guns in church. About one year ago the church moved to a new location several miles away. Does the actual knowledge of the "no-gun" policy apply to the new building, assuming you originally heard it?

2. I recently noticed the 30.05, .06 and .07 notices posted in the Sunday bulletin in very, very small print (not bold either) down at the bottom of one of the pages. Does that prevent someone from carrying in the church? Especially, if you never heard the original policy from probably about four years ago or never saw it in the bulletin?

Thanks in advance. I am anxious to hear everyone's thoughts.

So, to reiterate, the Church must have The Sign(s) posted on the building where people are likely to see it, or someone who works at the church can say "No Guns." as you enter. If none of this occurs and they discover you with a weapon and they tell you to leave and you leave immediately, that is a defense to prosecution.

 

[alternative]

Not effective notice and I’d have a field day in court with this by simply asking can you prove I picked up that bulletin?

But let’s back up the how TPC30.06 really works. A sign is posted and a license holder goes past it. Someone has to get LE involved to write the ticket. Who’s calling the cops and on what grounds, because nobody on staff has the authority to write the citation.

Continuing with that, let’s say a staff member says I’m sorry, but you have to leave. Okay, I leave; no violation.

Wait, the staff says “you’re can’t leave until the cops get here to trespass you.” Nope; illegal detention by the staff member and I relate to the cop that I tried to leave and was detained against my will. Staff member gets arrested.

Just checked the DPS statistics; still zero 30.06 convictions and a grand total of 4 UCW by a license holder convictions.

The op said he read it in the bulletin. He has been given effective notice. Not disagreeing with everything else that you wrote but notice can either be by signs, verbal or written and op said he read it in the bulletin. If he wasn't honest about it then he may not have received effective notice.

 

[alternative]

So, to reiterate, the Church must have The Sign(s) posted on the building where people are likely to see it, or someone who works at the church can say "No Guns." as you enter. If none of this occurs and they discover you with a weapon and they tell you to leave and you leave immediately, that is a defense to prosecution.

Or written notice. Op read it in the church bulletin.

 

[ZX9RCAM]

Or written notice. Op read it in the church bulletin.

He may have read it, but he was given verbal notice 3 sundays in a row.

But evidently verbal notice has an expiration date.

 

[toddnjoyce]

He may have read it, but he was given verbal notice 3 sundays in a row.

But evidently verbal notice has an expiration date.

All notices, written or verbal expire as soon as you leave the building.

For example if today a business has a sign up and tomorrow it doesn’t, you can’t be charged tomorrow because there is no effective notice at the time the event occurred.

 

[ZX9RCAM]

All notices, written or verbal expire as soon as you leave the building.

For example if today a business has a sign up and tomorrow it doesn’t, you can’t be charged tomorrow because there is no effective notice at the time the event occurred.

Okay, I can understand that.
Didn't make sense before.
Thanks.

 

[Eastexasrick]

Todd keeps it simple, and clear
If you don't have a Todd you need a legal dictionary, and the statues in front of you to figure out if you are in compliance.
As we are discussing statues, we are in the realm of effective notice, at the time of the occurrence, and not constructive knowledge of an intention.

 

[ZX9RCAM]

Todd keeps it simple, and clear
If you don't have a Todd you need a legal dictionary, and the statues in front of you to figure out if you are in compliance.
As we are discussing statues, we are in the realm of effective notice, at the time of the occurrence, and not constructive knowledge of an intention.

Yes, for us dummies....