Ukraine War and Politics

[Eastexasrick]

Proxy warfare is not a new thing.

No shit Sherlock. You are a master of the obvious.
For your future reference:

In the mid 18th century the French entered, by your definition a " Proxy War", which lasted until 1783. They funded a seditious war against Great Britain, on what was to become United States soil.

 

[Johnny Diamond]

You didn’t just misspell a word, you continuously used the wrong word. And I didn’t forget who made an argument. I was just pointing out the inconsistencies in the pro proxy war narratives.

The proof is that Ukraine is smaller than it was at the start of 2022, and they don’t even have a plan on how to change that.

Ad hominem attacks again....OK been awhile I'll give you credit for infrequently using it. LOL

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[Mowingmaniac 24/7]

"There you go again twisting words and meanings."

How very 'Ronald Reagan' of you (who I admired immensely)...very statesman-like' of you olde boy...

 

[Havok1]

Again, i didn't say that. You can't force me to defend an argument i didn't make.


Why do you think the earth is flat?

Lol. I was just asking if you agreed.

I've explained before, but this topic seems to be next on your list so let me remind you:

1) I get to choose what things I put my energy into. I like flying and trucks and cars and motorcycles, but I choose where to put my time, energy and money. You get to support russia, I get to support Ukraine.

2) Ukraine is different from an intranational fight for control because they were and are a sovereign nation. If a husband and wife want to fight and yell at each other, thats their business (until I'm working or it sounds like someone is being killed) but when one person kicks in the door to their neighbor's house that's another matter and I'm much more inclined to go help. To make an easy model for you "civil war vs invasion" I dont care much for what happens in Sudan or gaza or russia, until it causes problems for others.

3) Not actively helping every cause doesn't mean I cant help any cause, and it doesn't mean I dont agree with a particular faction in those other fights.

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That’s cool. I’m just curious. I’d say the people in Israel probably think Gaza has harmed them quite a bit. There is a lot of evil stuff in this world. If you care about Ukraine, and only Ukraine, that’s entirely up to you. but the world is bigger than Ukraine, and that’s why most people dont look at it in isolation the way you do.

You keep making that neighbor reference. Ukraine isn’t our neighbor. They aren’t even in the same neighborhood. Every day someone that is far closer to being your neighbor than Ukraine is harmed and you don’t do a thing about it.

There you go again twisting words and meanings.

The only group interested in continuing this war is russia. russia invaded, russia is occupying Ukrainian land. As soon as russia leaves the war will be over just as it was in 2014 before they sent their troops into Ukraine.

"Pro proxy war" is intentionally misleading and is wrong. The folks to whom you refer with that term want the war over. Just as someone defending themselves from a robbery want the robbery over. To call someone defending themselves "pro violence" or "pro war" is simply idiotic and foolish.

"The mouth of fools poureth out foolishness" so I'm not surprised...

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Our government absolutely wants to continue the proxy war, or at least enough of them for it to be able to continue. Pro proxy war isn’t misleading at all. If you are in favor of continuing to fund the proxy war, then you are pro proxy war. If you think that your position is the correct one, then it shouldn’t bother you.

 

[zackmars]

Lol. I was just asking if you agreed.

Bs. You were winding up for a gotcha

"So you’d agree that the narrative that we need to help Ukraine because they will invade Poland next is bullshit?

Did you go to Iraq to help them as well? What about to Africa? Or Mexico? Why are you so interested in Ukraine specifically with everything that goes on in the world?
Also, just because YOU have some interest in Ukraine, does not mean it’s in our nations interest."

I can't believe you think the moon landing was fake!

 

[cycleguy2300]

Lol. I was just asking if you agreed.

That’s cool. I’m just curious. I’d say the people in Israel probably think Gaza has harmed them quite a bit. There is a lot of evil stuff in this world. If you care about Ukraine, and only Ukraine, that’s entirely up to you. but the world is bigger than Ukraine, and that’s why most people dont look at it in isolation the way you do.

You keep making that neighbor reference. Ukraine isn’t our neighbor. They aren’t even in the same neighborhood. Every day someone that is far closer to being your neighbor than Ukraine is harmed and you don’t do a thing about it.

Our government absolutely wants to continue the proxy war, or at least enough of them for it to be able to continue. Pro proxy war isn’t misleading at all. If you are in favor of continuing to fund the proxy war, then you are pro proxy war. If you think that your position is the correct one, then it shouldn’t bother you.

Can you do anything but lie and troll?

Never said Ukraine was my only concern or care. Despite my deep and abiding hatred for what hamas and its apologists* stand for Isreal has it handled...

(*including certain members here who have received bans for their overt antisemitism...)

The topic of "who is my neighbor" was brought up in the past by you but it was answered many, many years before... I can think of no better war to describe who is your neighbor than this:

Which of these three, do you think, proved to be a neighbor to the man who fell among the robbers?” He said, “The one who showed him mercy.” And Jesus said to him, “You go, and do likewise.”

Ukraine was attacked, they begged for help and I and others went and helped.


It is clear you are not just a neutral party asking questions in good faith, but support russia based on your repeated use of russian propaganda phrases and arguments and the twisting replies and biasing paraphrases... why hide what you believe? Its not like you will get banned for supporting russia like you did when you did with the antisemitic posts innthe Isreal/hamas thread.

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[Havok1]

Can you do anything but lie and troll?

Never said Ukraine was my only concern or care. Despite my deep and abiding hatred for what hamas and its apologists stand for Isreal has it handled...

(including certain members here who have received bans for their overt antisemitism...)

The topic of "who is my neighbor" was brought up in the past by you but it was answered many, many years before... I can think of no better war to describe who is your neighbor than this:



Ukraine was attacked, they begged for help and I and others went and helped.


It is clear you are not just a neutral party asking questionsin good faith, but support russia based on your repeated use of russian propaganda phrases and arguments and the twisting replies and biasing paraphrases... why hide what you believe? Its not like you will get banned for supporting russia like you did when you did with the antisemitic posts innthe Isreal/hamas thread.

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You have repeatedly called me a liar, and a troll, but never actually had any examples. It’s all based on the fact that I disagree with you and point out your inaccuracies. What’s so interesting is that all this bad stuff happens around the world, and you’re perfectly fine ignoring it, but all because you chose to go visit Ukraine, you take it very personally when people don’t support the proxy war. The same comments you make to me, you make to everyone else who disagrees with you.

You have also never been able to show a single time that I have referred to Russian propaganda. It’s just your go to excuse for everything that you disagree with.

Which posts in the Israel thread are you talking about? I’ve never made any antisemitic posts.

 

[Eastexasrick]

Our government absolutely wants to continue the proxy war, or at least enough of them for it to be able to continue. Pro proxy war isn’t misleading at all. If you are in favor of continuing to fund the proxy war, then you are pro proxy war.

Your record is skipping,

 

[BigRed]

Which of these three, do you think, proved to be a neighbor to the man who fell among the robbers?” He said, “The one who showed him mercy.” And Jesus said to him, “You go, and do likewise.”

Where is the verse where Jesus said to plunder your neighbor?

 

[cycleguy2300]

Where is the verse where Jesus said to plunder your neighbor?

You mean give to Caesar what is Caesar's?

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[Johnny Diamond]

Was going to say that but, I would rather watch the fight these days

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[BigRed]

You mean give to Caesar what is Caesar's?

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Hardley.

Where does Christ advocate invoking the power of state to carry out your objectives or his commandments?

 

[cycleguy2300]

Hardley.

Where does Christ advocate invoking the power of state to carry out your objectives or his commandments?

1 Tim 6:18?

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[Johnny Diamond]

Hardley.

Where does Christ advocate invoking the power of state to carry out your objectives or his commandments?

Without getting into theology, the question was whether or not to pay taxes? To which Christ asks if they have a coin and then asks who's inscription is on it? And then says render unto Caesar that which is Caesars.
In light of the many times that taxes have been brought up, it seems you bringing that reference up should eliminate any further tax policy questions...or will you shift and dodge the facts again?
Oops

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[BigRed]

No, not really. Either way the government will take that, and spend that money.

Noted for future.

"I don't think American taxpayers should be forced to fund abortions"

The government was going to spend that money anyway.

"I don't think American taxpayers should be forced to fund welfare to illegal aliens"

The government was going to spend that money anyway.

"I don't think American taxpayers should be forced to fund gender altering medical costs."

The government was going to spend that money anyway.

"I don't think American taxpayers should be forced to fund habitrails for wildlife crossings"

The government was going to spend that money anyway.


Nothing is off the table. The government was going to spend that money anyway.

 

[Johnny Diamond]

You are absolutely right! Now what?

Am I happy about it NO what can I do about it... suppose I could spend all of my day bitching about it like you.....or not.

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[cycleguy2300]

Noted for future.

"I don't think American taxpayers should be forced to fund abortions"

The government was going to spend that money anyway.

"I don't think American taxpayers should be forced to fund welfare to illegal aliens"

The government was going to spend that money anyway.

"I don't think American taxpayers should be forced to fund gender altering medical costs."

The government was going to spend that money anyway.

"I don't think American taxpayers should be forced to fund habitrails for wildlife crossings"

The government was going to spend that money anyway.


Nothing is off the table. The government was going to spend that money anyway.

So change the government which is the American Govt, and not something for this thread

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[BigRed]

1 Tim 6:18?

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Nothing to do with state. You cannot legislate charity, only theft. State gives nothing without taking from somebody by force.

 

[BigRed]

Without getting into theology, the question was whether or not to pay taxes? To which Christ asks if they have a coin and then asks who's inscription is on it? And then says render unto Caesar that which is Caesars.
In light of the many times that taxes have been brought up, it seems you bringing that reference up should eliminate any further tax policy questions...or will you shift and dodge the facts again?
Oops

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Read the whole thing...Mat 17 24-27.

 

[BigRed]

So change the government which is the American Govt, and not something for this thread

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I'm simply noting that when folks advocate "we should give federal money for this and federal money for that" as if they are somehow good and noble for doing so, they are anything but. What they are advocating for is taking from somebody else to give to somebody else.