Tomcat Exploded

[zackmars]

It's not that they're refusing to return it, it's just that every time I call, they tell me to wait on a follow-up email and call from a manager. I get neither. I call them back, they say the same thing and it just keeps repeating like that. For months.

They also say I owe them money for labor. Since they won't warranty the gun, I don't know what labor they could've done beyond look at the gun and say "yep, it exploded."

I just want to harvest the parts off the frame, but if they're going to charge me, then I'd rather let them keep it I guess.

Ok I'm confused, you say you're getting the run around, you aren't getting the needed follow-up call/email.

Then they say you owe them for labor. While i think thats BS, you aren't paying

Seems like you're at an impasse

 

[leVieux]

It sucks that beretta isn't taking care of you, but the tomcat is basically on the bleeding edge of .32 auto, considering how small it is.

It's not exactly surprising Beretta isn't helping you since you exceeded what the design was capable of handling.

<>

Darn thing is chunky, wider than a PPKS .380 by quite a bit.

The “Fat Boy” of pocket mini-guns.

<>

 

[Eastexasrick]

It's not that they're refusing to return it, it's just that every time I call, they tell me to wait on a follow-up email and call from a manager. I get neither. I call them back, they say the same thing and it just keeps repeating like that. For months.

They also say I owe them money for labor. Since they won't warranty the gun, I don't know what labor they could've done beyond look at the gun and say "yep, it exploded."

I just want to harvest the parts off the frame, but if they're going to charge me, then I'd rather let them keep it I guess.

Well you can lay back and let them screw you and the customer, pay their BS bill, or:
Best defense is an offense. Get offensive. Send them a bill, not a big long elaborate demand. It should include your time, labor, including minimum charges for each call, the price of the gun, shipping, and handling. This on your letterhead. No demand for a new gun or warranty, or the old gun, just the bill against them.

Include what a minimum payment is, amount of full payment, and interest rate on the amount still accruing if not paid.
Attach it to an email and send it certified to them. If no immediate response follow up with email and snail mail. it should read, collection eminent notice. That should go to someone of authority. If you really want to F with them have a friend call with a " collection" agency, after 30 days, demanding the minimum payment, the threat is JP suit will be filed to secure judgment on the delinquent account.
You may get little more than you have gotten so far. But what you are getting now is the bums rush.
I pulled this shit, with coaching from a friend who was in collections. The results were acceptable, and it was fun.

 

[zackmars]

<>

Darn thing is chunky, wider than a PPKS .380 by quite a bit.

The “Fat Boy” of pocket mini-guns.

<>

1" vs 1.1" not by much.

And even comparing the Beretta to the .32 ppk, the Beretta is a MUCH nicer gun to shoot, as long as you don't try to shoot what SAAMI would consider to be +p+

 

[PinnedandRecessed]

No, that analogy would work for something like putting .300blk in a 5.56 chamber. This is more like "we recommend premium gasoline" but putting regular unleaded causes the car to burst into flames. It's a .32acp gun and the customer was using factory .32acp ammo. The warning says 'increased wear-and-tear' not 'you're going to need a pirate hook installed where your hand used to be'. Pretty much half of the .32acp ammo on the market is too hot for this gun. Even a very experienced and knowledgeable gun owner could make this mistake. What if you bought the gun used and it didn't have the slip of paper warning you? If I bought a modern gun stamped '9x19' I could safely assume any 9x19 factory ammo could be run through it without a catastrophic failure.

Bottom line is you're expecting a manufacturer to cover end user error.

 

[SpenceNaz]

Bottom line is you're expecting a manufacturer to cover end user error.

I've assumed since day 1 they wouldn't warranty it. I just think it's crazy that they're selling these things in the first place. They should re-design it to handle CIP loads or not sell them at all.

 

[zackmars]

I've assumed since day 1 they wouldn't warranty it. I just think it's crazy that they're selling these things in the first place. They should re-design it to handle CIP loads or not sell them at all.

Then you'd probably complain when it won't run SAAMI ammo properly.

 

[SpenceNaz]

Then you'd probably complain when it won't run SAAMI ammo properly.

Not cycling correctly is way less of an issue than almost blowing someone's fingers off.

 

[zackmars]

Not cycling correctly is way less of an issue than almost blowing someone's fingers off.

The difference, according to SAAMI, between standard pressure ammo and +P is an increase of 10%


The difference between SAAMI and CIP spec ammo is 23%.

A firearm, especially a tiny direct blowback cannot be made to work with both ends of that spectrum, either they'd need to make it weigh and extra half pound, or increase the spring tension so much, you'd turn racking the slide, disassembly and reassembly into a nightmare. Have you ever tried to detail strip a bobcat or tomcat? Those recoil springs are major PITA's, and thats with stock springs.


You picked the weakest operating system, in the smallest footprint you could, and shot it with ammo that was 23% hotter than what the manual recommend.

Thats like buying a hipoint, and getting mad when it won't handle a diet of 9BPLE

 

[Gordo]

Talked with a long time gun buddy, and he has sent 2 of them back due to issues (cracks?).
He also says that no way he would ever consider owning, or shooting one, as they have a bad reputation.

How common is CIP ammo in this country?

 

[zackmars]

Talked with a long time gun buddy, and he has sent 2 of them back due to issues (cracks?).
He also says that no way he would ever consider owning, or shooting one, as they have a bad reputation.

How common is CIP ammo in this country?

Not super common. Just PPU and S&B. Maybe some other small European brands and surplus imports.

Last time i looked for .32 acp, most options were Remington, PMC, and magtech

 

[SpenceNaz]

There's also Fiocchi and Norma and Geco. I wouldn't say it's uncommon at all.

 

[zackmars]

There's also Fiocchi and Norma and Geco. I wouldn't say it's uncommon at all.

It's all that was available back when the gun was introduced into the US market.

 

[PinnedandRecessed]

You picked the weakest operating system, in the smallest footprint you could, and shot it with ammo that was 23% hotter than what the manual recommend.

...and evidently it's Beretta's fault for making it. I'm all for improving design and materials but every manufacturer can't be to blame for every instance their product, that was designed to operate within specific parameters, is misused.

 

[Vaquero]

It's all that was available back when the gun was introduced into the US market.

Then quit blaming the OP.
It's a manufacturer issue. But they sent out a note.
I've met the OP.
He wouldn't remember me, but that's irrelevant.
I know he's just trying to warn some people.
He stands nothing to gain from this experience.

 

[Hoji]

My mouse gun in .32 ACP is a NAA Guardian. No restrictions from manufacturer on ammo.

 

[SpenceNaz]

...and evidently it's Beretta's fault for making it. I'm all for improving design and materials but every manufacturer can't be to blame for every instance their product, that was designed to operate within specific parameters, is misused.

But in this context "misuse" is something that could happen to anyone. Guns are sold used all the time with no box or paperwork, and very few people will even know about the ft/lbs requirement for ammo. They'll see a gun marked '.32acp' and assume it's fine. If this was caused by a faulty barrel, then it's on them. If it was caused by the design not being able to handle that particular load, then they are selling something that could hurt people. People will continue to make this mistake. Anyone would assume factory ammo through that gun would be fine. It'd be one thing if it was some antique milsurp gun, but this is a modern-production pistol.

 

[PinnedandRecessed]

But in this context "misuse" is something that could happen to anyone. Guns are sold used all the time with no box or paperwork, and very few people will even know about the ft/lbs requirement for ammo. They'll see a gun marked '.32acp' and assume it's fine. If this was caused by a faulty barrel, then it's on them. If it was caused by the design not being able to handle that particular load, then they are selling something that could hurt people. People will continue to make this mistake. Anyone would assume factory ammo through that gun would be fine. It'd be one thing if it was some antique milsurp gun, but this is a modern-production pistol.

A valid point but it also presents a slippery slope.

 

[PinnedandRecessed]

I've always skipped from 22lr to 380acp.

 

[Darqhelmet]

I've always skipped from 22lr to 380acp.

Not a fan of .32 pillow fight?