Road Trip with Numerous Guns

[nalioth]

From the article, for those who didn't read it: "Travelers should be aware that some state and local governments treat this federal provision as an “affirmative defense” that may only be raised after an arrest." The whole reason I am asking for help is to avoid getting arrested and not having to deal with this. I know AZ, NM, and TX are gun-friendly but the individual LEO is my concern.

Are you a recent transplant from up nawth?

Southwestern LEOs have better things to do than find things to mess with people over. . .

The statement you quote is there due wholly in part to New York City and New Jersey.

 

[Texan2]

I'm going to be semi-moving from AZ to Houston in less than a month and I am planning on traveling with almost all of my guns (8...ish). I've read up and I know the laws of the states that I'm traveling through, and I will be abiding by them. However, I'm afraid that 8 guns with ammo cans for them plus a bug out box in a big, black truck will make me look like a "dangerous, evil militia member." I've made this trip a couple of times in the past and I've never been pulled over and I plan on driving the speed limit like I have always done in the past. My truck is current on all registration, inspection, etc and everything is in proper working order. However, if I do get pulled over I am certain that I will be arrested. I know there is a federal law that allows a person to transport firearms for moving (which I'm doing) but no LEO is going to care.

What it boils down to is that I am guide less at the moment. Does anyone have any ideas about what to do to possibly minimize any chance of my imprisonment if I get pulled over?

I guess the implication that even though you are not doing anything illegal cops will still arrest you anyway is a bit insulting. Cops dont look for reasons to arrest people who are merely traveling down the road...despite what some would like you to believe.

This is especially true in Texas and nearby states. I know hundreds of cops and I have never heard of one who made an arrest and took someone to jail because they had a gun or guns in the car when no law was being broken. Even USBP will not mess with you 99% of the time.

so saying that even though there is a law that protects you, "no LEO is going to care" is pure paranoia or if you get pulled over you "are certain that I will be arrested" is either trolling or you have recieved really, really bad info somewhere.

 

[1rightguy]

I guess the implication that even though you are not doing anything illegal cops will still arrest you anyway is a bit insulting. Cops dont look for reasons to arrest people who are merely traveling down the road...despite what some would like you to believe.

This is especially true in Texas and nearby states. I know hundreds of cops and I have never heard of one who made an arrest and took someone to jail because they had a gun or guns in the car when no law was being broken. Even USBP will not mess with you 99% of the time.

so saying that even though there is a law that protects you, "no LEO is going to care" is pure paranoia or if you get pulled over you "are certain that I will be arrested" is either trolling or you have recieved really, really bad info somewhere.

I once thought that way but experiance has taught me differant. It brings me no pleasure.

 

[Texan2]

I once thought that way but experiance has taught me differant. It brings me no pleasure.

um.....ok???

 

[majormadmax]

I once thought that way but experiance has taught me differant. It brings me no pleasure.

Odd, 'cause my experience has been completely the opposite. Every encounter I have had with law enforcement was for good reason (mostly traffic violations). I have never been mistreated or sandbagged in any way, but then again I have always been polite and respectful to the officer. Of course, some have been more friendly and polite than others; but even the ones that were jerks were mainly professional in that they've not done anything other than have a bit of attitude.

It's all a matter of common sense. If traveling with a large number of guns (and I don't consider eight to be a big number, I regularly take that many to the range!) keep them unloaded and in cases in the back of the vehicle. Obviously if you have a concealed license that the state you're in recognizes, you can have a loaded pistol on you or within close reach but be aware of the state laws when it comes to reporting it to police if there is an encounter. I have yet to meet a police officer who had a huge amount of heartburn on carrying, I most I met support it to one degree or another.

To the OP, there's nothing to worry about. I work with a guy who travels with large numbers of firearms on a regular basis (he's a manufacturer and a competitive shooter). He's got a few stories about LEO encounters that were "interesting" because of that, but he's never been arrested or even harassed about it as far as I can recall. Unless you appear to be involved in some illegal activity, there's nothing to be concerned with. Drive safe, and be sure your weapons are secure when you stop. My biggest fear would be theft, not an encounter with the police!

Cheers! M2

 

[Texan2]

My biggest fear would be theft, not an encounter with the police!

+1

 

[1rightguy]

Odd, 'cause my experience has been completely the opposite. Every encounter I have had with law enforcement was for good reason (mostly traffic violations). I have never been mistreated or sandbagged in any way, but then again I have always been polite and respectful to the officer. Of course, some have been more friendly and polite than others; but even the ones that were jerks were mainly professional in that they've not done anything other than have a bit of attitude.

It's all a matter of common sense. If traveling with a large number of guns (and I don't consider eight to be a big number, I regularly take that many to the range!) keep them unloaded and in cases in the back of the vehicle. Obviously if you have a concealed license that the state you're in recognizes, you can have a loaded pistol on you or within close reach but be aware of the state laws when it comes to reporting it to police if there is an encounter. I have yet to meet a police officer who had a huge amount of heartburn on carrying, I most I met support it to one degree or another.

To the OP, there's nothing to worry about. I work with a guy who travels with large numbers of firearms on a regular basis (he's a manufacturer and a competitive shooter). He's got a few stories about LEO encounters that were "interesting" because of that, but he's never been arrested or even harassed about it as far as I can recall. Unless you appear to be involved in some illegal activity, there's nothing to be concerned with. Drive safe, and be sure your weapons are secure when you stop. My biggest fear would be theft, not an encounter with the police!

Cheers! M2

Bully for you and your never having a bad experiance and you get the "polite to police" medal for today. Wear it proud. Theft would be my biggest fear too but "you have nothing to worry about" is just wrong.

 

[Texan2]

Bully for you and your never having a bad experiance and you get the "polite to police" medal for today. Wear it proud. Theft would be my biggest fear too but "you have nothing to worry about" is just wrong.

Thousands drive around with lots of guns everyday. Unless they are breaking a law they dont go to jail. Period. What is there to worry about besides theft?
Since you have yet to tell us why you had a bad experience it is hard to give it any credence.

 

[Texan2]

Bully for you and your never having a bad experiance and you get the "polite to police" medal for today. Wear it proud.

You should be polite to the police. Not to get a medal but because it is the civilized thing to do. Based on your posts in this thread I can see why you may have some issues with a LE contact.

 

[Charlie]

My Mama told me to be polite to everybody and when circumstances caused that to be impossible, cut off dialogue and exit as soon as possible.

 

[1rightguy]

You should be polite to the police. Not to get a medal but because it is the civilized thing to do. Based on your posts in this thread I can see why you may have some issues with a LE contact.

My "bully" comment is a little bitchy and I should have put it another way. I agree as would most people that the vast majority of people in LE are honorable, my father retired a few years ago after 35 years with SAPD giving me a semi inside angle to that honor. I have always been polite and civilized when dealing with police and thanks to a bunch of cash to a good lawyer, my record is pure as the driven snow even though I had an experience. We beat charges because of a couple stupid cops and that's a fact. I'm not saying cops are stupid, just these cops that I had contact with, even though I was very sweet with them as you think I should be.
The implication that my being polite makes a differance proves my point that the OP needs to be concerned. Why does that make a differance? Your statment implies that you have an option to stick it to me if I hurt your feelings by acting rude and you make a very biased assumption with your seeing why I may have had some issues with LE comment. Maybe that very attitude is why good citizens have concerns like that of the OP.

 

[Texan2]

How do you come up with these wild conclusions? I will stick it to you if you hurt my feelings? where did I say that? you misread my posts if that is what you concluded. I did not ever say you needed to be "very sweet". I said be polite. Not because it makes a difference in the outcome but because it is the right thing to do. You obviously have some deep seeded issues with LE despite the fact you father spent 35 years in that profession.

I know lots of "good citizens". I dont know any that are afraid of the cops when they arent doing anything illegal.

 

[TexasRedneck]

We beat charges because of a couple stupid cops and that's a fact. I'm not saying cops are stupid, just these cops that I had contact with, even though I was very sweet with them as you think I should be.
The implication that my being polite makes a differance proves my point that the OP needs to be concerned. Why does that make a differance? Your statment implies that you have an option to stick it to me if I hurt your feelings by acting rude and you make a very biased assumption with your seeing why I may have had some issues with LE comment. Maybe that very attitude is why good citizens have concerns like that of the OP.

You need to be polite because that's the PROPER thing to do. If you don't understand that - especially as the son of a long-time LEO as you claim....then I am gonna call "bullshit".

I ROUTINELY travel armed - have since the early 70's, back when it wasn't "legal" to do so. Despite several instances where LEO's were aware that I was armed, I *never* had any serious problems. I routinely travel with 2-4 firearms at all times, and the only thing I MIGHT get is a "damn- you like to be prepared!" type of comment. I then jokingly ask them if THEY carry a backup....<G>

 

[1rightguy]

How do you come up with these wild conclusions? I will stick it to you if you hurt my feelings? where did I say that? you misread my posts if that is what you concluded. I did not ever say you needed to be "very sweet". I said be polite. Not because it makes a difference in the outcome but because it is the right thing to do. You obviously have some deep seeded issues with LE despite the fact you father spent 35 years in that profession.

I know lots of "good citizens". I dont know any that are afraid of the cops when they arent doing anything illegal.

A wild conclusion would be that I obviously have deep seeded issues with LE, I do not. I do have issues with people telling me how I "should" act or "it's the PROPER thing to do" when The Constiution does that for me in theses scenerios. I also have issues with the notion that because most people in LE are good, there are no bad ones and that seems to be the only argument so far.
I'm done, have a good Easter.

 

[TexasRedneck]

A wild conclusion would be that I obviously have deep seeded issues with LE, I do not. I do have issues with people telling me how I "should" act or "it's the PROPER thing to do" when The Constiution does that for me in theses scenerios. I also have issues with the notion that because most people in LE are good, there are no bad ones and that seems to be the only argument so far.
I'm done, have a good Easter.

Ah......yer hand has been called, an' now ya wanna run, eh?

Got news for you....because obviously yer Daddy wasn't able to get it through your thick skull. Just because something is (or is not) covered by a "law" doesn't mean there's no guidance. It's called things such as "usual and customary", "common sense", or simply "common courtesy". Try it some time - you might be surprised at the difference it can make.

 

[MR Redneck]

This is getting funny.
The simply fact that it's 100% legal for the man to transport all of his guns, loaded or unloaded, is not illegal in Texas as long as your not conducting a crime is whats important.
Issues with the cops if he get pulled over?? It all depends on who pulls you over. That is from my own experiance. Most cops that I have been involved with anything relating to firearms acted preety damn reasonable. Sure their going to have some questions simply because its their job. I dont see anything wrong with it either.
On the other hand, I have had contact with a few cops that had no damn respect for a persons rights what so ever. Am I sorry for it, hell no! Im always happy to be the one to find those kind of people. It's those kind of people that need to be weeded OUT.
The Law is the Law. When it becames laws that apply to everyone and enforced the same by all LE, thats the day that citizen and police interaction will have no negative issue, " unless your a criminal".
We dont live in a perfect world, so that pretty much why I see this subject being posted.

 

[1rightguy]

Ah......yer hand has been called, an' now ya wanna run, eh?

Got news for you....because obviously yer Daddy wasn't able to get it through your thick skull. Just because something is (or is not) covered by a "law" doesn't mean there's no guidance. It's called things such as "usual and customary", "common sense", or simply "common courtesy". Try it some time - you might be surprised at the difference it can make.

My hand was called how? By you calling BS? What part do you think is BS? The premise that the OP has nothing to worry about with LE because you have never had a problem is silly and neither one of you are actually getting my point . I grew tired of explaning. When you resort to name calling (thick skull) you have given up. Read my posts and tell me where I indicated I was anything but courtious and respecful and then follow your own advice about common courtesy. All I did was offer my opinion, that is how forums work and all I got was, I'm a liar, I have issues and other weak personal attacks.
Good day Sir, but I'm not running. I'll be around if you want to share more pearls of wisdom.

 

[Bithabus]

To address some of the common comments:
1. Yes I am serious. If you aren't, the Off-Topic forums are located farther down on the home page of this site.
2. I know I am not doing anything illegal, but not all LEO care.
3. The route I am taking bypasses Border Patrol stations and other federal agency "checkpoints."
4. It's a 20 hour drive, so I'm going to be sleeping in the truck. The vehicle will be occupied the entire time (minus pee breaks, when it will be in a high-visibility area).
5. The guns/ammo will be underneath my other luggage (clothes, etc.) and not visible.



Thanks for the support.



This is a big help. Thanks for the link. From the article, for those who didn't read it: "Travelers should be aware that some state and local governments treat this federal provision as an “affirmative defense” that may only be raised after an arrest." The whole reason I am asking for help is to avoid getting arrested and not having to deal with this. I know AZ, NM, and TX are gun-friendly but the individual LEO is my concern.



More good advice. Thanks!

Well your post did sound a bit crazy. "if I do get pulled over I am certain that I will be arrested."

There are two ways to get arrested: do something illegal, or something the Police think is illegal. In your case you have nothing to worry about.

 

[LilIrishTemper]

I think 99% is your over thinking it.

I was stopped when I moved to Texas by a LA state trooper for following to close on the interstate and had 5 long guns, 2 handguns and a bunch of 50 cal army ammo cans. I had a Oklahoma DL, a Florida CHL with a Texas address. Needless to say, if that doesn't scream WTF? to an LEO I don't know what does. But needless to say he was cool, I told him what was in the car, he asked if I had anything like C4 jokingly to see if I laughed or got nervous, ask if he could look, told him yep. Looked, ran my plates & DL and sent me on my merry way, not even a ticket.

No Tazing, pepper spray, billyclubs or handcuffs were used on me.

 

[SIG_Fiend]

Why be polite? Maybe the more correct question is why NOT be polite? I'm just speaking generally but, I'll never understand the people that feel it's their right to be an A-hole all the time. Being polite just makes everything run more smoothly, and it's just a positive thing to be so why not do it?

Thinking back on it, I have only had 1 less than positive experience with an officer, and it really wasn't a big deal. I can tell you, in the past, I have met quite a few different officers as a "customer" of theirs, so much so that I almost lost my license at one point from all the speeding tickets. I know, stupid, but I never drive dangerously at least, just a tad fast but only if it's safe to do so. Haven't had a ticket in quite awhile though. This one time I got a ticket, it was on a wide open road with no one else around for miles, and I was doing 10mph over....in a mini van....on my way to pick up my parents from the airport. Yeah, technically I was exceeding the speed limit, but if the tables were turned I would have only issued a warning in that situation (no one else around, just not a big deal, and I was polite). Oh well. Can't win 'em all.

You want to know what I really remember though? I remember several positive experiences with officers. Last one I remember, I was pulled over at a gas station after 1am, in my '87 911 Turbo (guards red, Kinesis wheels, whale tail, total cop magnet right? lol). The station was closed, and almost all the lights were off so it was a bit dark. My throttle linkage fell off in the middle of the intersection next to the station (stupid me forgetting to replace a retaining clip, those damn "extra" parts! LOL). So I'm laying under the rear bumper, using my cell phone flashlight to look under the engine bay and find out what's wrong. Moments later, a Hays county Sheriff is driving by and pulls into the lot. Needless to say, it's easy to see how this could look shady, dark lot, nice car, me with a flashlight, etc. The officer asks a few questions, I politely respond, he sees nothing shady is going down so what does he do? He takes his flash light out, walks with me out to the intersection to help me find the throttle linkage, then he helps me get it back on the car. He was a genuinely nice guy.

There was also the DPS officer at a Whataburger that Alan and I talked to for like 3hrs or so on a Friday or Saturday night at something like 1am. Cool guy, probably bored to death on his security detail and glad to talk to break up the monotony, but still we had a good time shooting the sh*t. Yeah, there are a few bad apples, but every officer isn't some mindless robot storm trooper. They are people, civilians, just like the rest of us.