Police shooting Springfield IL bodycam video released.

[Renegade]

Throwing boiling water on someone would 100% meet the standard for a deadly weapon in Texas.

Everything is a deadly weapon | Texas District & County Attorneys Association

By Benjamin I. Kaminar Assistant County & District Attorney in Lamar County There is a long-running thread on the TDCAA user forums entitled “A Frog is a Deadly Weapon.”[1] Over the years…

www.tdcaa.com

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Agreed:


(3) "Deadly force" means force that is intended or known by the actor to cause, or in the manner of its use or intended use is capable of causing, death or serious bodily injury.

 

[Maxrobot]

The way I saw it, the woman called the cops to report someone prowling outside her home at 1 AM. 3 cops responded and found no one. they should have bid the lady goodnight and left.
Instead, they went in her home and interrogated her, asking for ID. As she was talking with them, she realized she had something on the stove and went to take it off. One cop joked about throwing water at them, another took it seriously and felt his life was in danger, shooting the woman in the face.
The other two cops were like "WTF Dude!!"

 

[cycleguy2300]

The way I saw it, the woman called the cops to report someone prowling outside her home at 1 AM. 3 cops responded and found no one. they should have bid the lady goodnight and left.
Instead, they went in her home and interrogated her, asking for ID. As she was talking with them, she realized she had something on the stove and went to take it off. One cop joked about throwing water at them, another took it seriously and felt his life was in danger, shooting the woman in the face.
The other two cops were like "WTF Dude!!"

Me and my partner literally cooked bacon for someone because we didn't want to risk them throwing hot grease on us...

Shouldn't have let her have access to the water if they were the least bit concerned about it being a weapon.

No reason to step into the kitchen giving her acces to a target with her newly acquired weapon.
***
Having a conversation with her about mental health would be a normal thing to do and it would likely be done inside (its just convenient for everyone). We literally have some people call us multiple times a week because of hallucinations/delusions about people in their attic, breaking in or burying bodies in their yard... its pretty common to recognize when they are needing to go back to a doctor to get meds changed to reduce the psychosis.

I've *heard* she had some MH issues, but don't know if that was why the officers went in or not.


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[DaBull]

I heard the risk of death by burns is high once you get to 50% of your total skin surface. I've seen videos where an angry Chinese cook dumped a boiling "hot pot" on a customer...mostly his chest and lap. I bet that customer died.

 

[Vaquero]

I heard the risk of death by burns is high once you get to 50% of your total skin surface. I've seen videos where an angry Chinese cook dumped a boiling "hot pot" on a customer...mostly his chest and lap. I bet that customer died.

I had 9% , so they say, 1st and 2nd degree combined. 1984
It isn't fun at all. If you've ever been there, you'll never forget.
Threaten me with fire and I'll turn chicken and haul ass.

 

[leVieux]

Bad shoot. Very very bad shoot.

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You mean that the officer used a GLOCK ?

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[leVieux]

I had 9% , so they say, 1st and 2nd degree combined. 1984
It isn't fun at all. If you've ever been there, you'll never forget.
Threaten me with fire and I'll turn chicken and haul ass.

<>

9% is a common estimate, b/c Trauma Surgeons are taught to use the ‘‘Rule of 9’s” to estimate extent of burns.

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[Mohawk600]

apparently boiling water is not considered a deadly weapon

 

[cycleguy2300]

apparently boiling water is not considered a deadly weapon

Oh but it is.... I doubt you would see charges in Texas except perhaps Austin or Houston.

This was a shooting that could/should have been avoided with better tactics and more common sense.

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[Mohawk600]

What was that? I didn't read you. Somebody type something?

 

[Lead Belly]

Bad situation all around. Deputy was fired and up on 1st degree murder rap.

Couple defense lawyers take on it:

 

[General Zod]

I had 9% , so they say, 1st and 2nd degree combined. 1984
It isn't fun at all. If you've ever been there, you'll never forget.
Threaten me with fire and I'll turn chicken and haul ass.

I've had small-ish (slightly less than saucer-sized) 2nd degree burns twice in my life, both from boiling liquid. Yeah, if someone threatened me with boiling water I'd take it seriously and respond in kind...





...but this situation was of the cop's making from what I can see.

 

[Mohawk600]

Stupid cop.........uncalled for

 

[cycleguy2300]

I've had small-ish (slightly less than saucer-sized) 2nd degree burns twice in my life, both from boiling liquid. Yeah, if someone threatened me with boiling water I'd take it seriously and respond in kind...





...but this situation was of the cop's making from what I can see.

They allowed a situation to develop that shouldn't have happened. Another case that is much more "bad at being a cop" than "bad cop". Better tactics and more maturity would likely have prevented this from happening.

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[Lead Belly]

They allowed a situation to develop that shouldn't have happened. Another case that is much more "bad at being a cop" than "bad cop". Better tactics and more maturity would likely have prevented this from happening.

He is bad at being a human being. I don't think any amount of training or tactics could make him successful in his chosen career. Not everyone can do every job-- several other departments quickly came to same conclusion; they tried him and found that he is a lost cause and a liability. It wasn't just dumping 3 in her head, it was the interaction starting with the door knock- he is incapable of reading people and has zero fuse. The call should have ended before he went into the house- no need to see her license or linger. I bet he cost that town $10M- Illinois is obscene with the judgements they deliver.

 

[cycleguy2300]

He is bad at being a human being. I don't think any amount of training or tactics could make him successful in his chosen career. Not everyone can do every job-- several other departments quickly came to same conclusion; they tried him and found that he is a lost cause and a liability. It wasn't just dumping 3 in her head, it was the interaction starting with the door knock- he is incapable of reading people and has zero fuse. The call should have ended before he went into the house- no need to see her license or linger. I bet he cost that town $10M- Illinois is obscene with the judgements they deliver.

I agree.

I'm good with the door knock and chatting with a woman with some mental health but then allowing her to get boiling water was a fail, his dealing with a woman with boiling water was a fail, approaching her when she had boiling water was a fail...



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[kbaxter60]

The whole thing is just sad.
I feel for the family, yet wish they had not retained that Crump race-baiter. He is going to make this awful situation much uglier.

 

[General Zod]

The whole thing is just sad.
I feel for the family, yet wish they had not retained that Crump race-baiter. He is going to make this awful situation much uglier.

And himself much richer...

 

[TheDan]

I don't understand how that escalated so quickly.

 

[Glenn B]

In any case..........boiling water is not a deadly weapon and doesn't justify deadly force.

I thought they have tasers for shit like that.

Boiling water does not need to be a likely cause of death; however, it indeed can cause significant & serious bodily injury. Thus it would be a justifiable defense if the defendant can articulate to a jury's or judges satisfaction why he thought it was such a threat in the given situation. Note, I am not making a judgement on the officer's actions nor on those of the deceased; I am only saying, without a doubt, that boiling water, in a substantial amount (such as a potful) hitting you anywhere, especially on exposed skin, can cause serious bodily injury.

(3)AA"Deadly force" means force that is intended or known by the actor to cause, or in the manner of its use or intended
use is capable of causing, death or serious bodily injury.

source: https://statutes.capitol.texas.gov/Docs/PE/pdf/PE.9.pdf