.357 Luger for high capacity lever gun

[Younggun]

Back story: A while back I decided I wanted to eventually get a .357 lever gun and have the barrel threaded and possibly cut down to 16', or maybe less and suppress it. Just seems like a really cool project to me. The more I kicked it around I started thinking about barrel length and the effect on capacity. Crossed my mind to just make shorter cartridges but I never gave it too much thought because I didn't have the gun. Now the Lever gun thread has me thinking about it again.



I looked at possibly using .38 S&W but the case diameter is larger. Besides, it wouldn't really save much in the way of length. If I could get the length down to 9mm OAL it would increase capacity by about 50%, that seems just about perfect.

Now I know how long my brass needs to be, and I should have a good estimate for starting loads since these will essentially be rimmed 9mm. Just need a way to resize the shortened brass. Luckily, I have already have 9mm dies.

WRONG. .38/.357 brass has a case diameter of .379", 9mm has a case diameter of .391". Back to the Lyman manual to look at case dimensions, and didn't have far to look. .380 ACP has a diameter of .374. Pretty close and I have a set of .380 dies collecting dust. Perfect.

So, what brass to use. I had figured .38 Spcl brass would be the obvious choice, but decided to check anyways. 9mm max pressure is ~35,000cup, .38Spcl is only showing listed pressures up to 19,000cup. Could be tough on the brass. .357 runs pressures over 40,000cup, .357 brass it is.

Only thing left is a way to trim the brass down to 9mm length. Went to midway and ordered case length guages and shell holders for 9mm and .357. I will have to probably have to modify the length guage to fit in the .35 case but no biggie. just some fine grit sand paper and a DeWalt should handle that. Should have them in about a week. In the mean time I will try to get some .357 brass trimmed to a rough length and ready for final prep work.

Really looking forward to this little project. Will test them in a Ruger Blackhawk and may bring some to Hicksville if anyone is willing to test feeding and reliability in a lever gun. Expecting velocities around 1000fps.

Will post updates as the project progresses.

 

[Jakashh]

Nifty

 

[Younggun]

I'm gonna sell the rights to AAC once it catches on and be rich.

They will market it with their all new "Fudd Tactical" division.

 

[orbitup]

 

[benenglish]

Prototype for the California market?

 

[Moonpie]

You're might run into a problem with the O.A.L. of the cartridge in the action cycling with a tube mag.

 

[Younggun]

It's possible, I'm hoping it will work out though.

Seems to work with different lengths on .22 platforms, hoping for the same in .357 platforms.

 

[Moonpie]

I'd try an 1892 Winchester action first. The 1894 Winchester is way to long. Maybe a Marlin 1894?
The 1873 action is real particular on O.A.L. of cartridge. This can be changed by using a different elevator.

 

[Younggun]

Good to know. Looked at some animations on the inner workings of a lever action and see where is could have an issue.

I'll move forwards with the project for now though. Only have $15 tied up in it.

 

[Vaquero]

Wadcutters and semi wadcutters don't feed. At all.

 

[TheDan]

I like it, but it might be hard to work the lever with that mag.

 

[Rebel]

Wadcutters and semi wadcutters don't feed. At all.

x2

 

[Winger Ed.]

Interesting project.
Another case/cartridge that's falling by the wayside, but might be worth looking at is the .38Super.
Its a pretty hot rod version of 9mm. Back in the day you could shoot it in the same competition league with .45ACP,
but 9mm was in a lower class/rating.

Something else to look at is the bolt face.
The .357 being a rimmed case. The bolt face and extractor may or may not jive up with the new cal. brass.

 

[DubiousDan]

Wadcutters and semi wadcutters don't feed. At all.

SWCs work in my Marlin 1894 in 357 and 45 Colt but I never tried wadcutters.

 

[Vaquero]

SWCs work in my Marlin 1894 in 357 and 45 Colt but I never tried wadcutters.

Cool. My 92 won't feed 'em at all in .38 or .357
Round nose or conical only.

 

[Younggun]

Still waiting on trimmers so I can play with some different loads.

Did the cheap shipping with the UPS/USPS hand off. Worst shipping method ever.

 

[DubiousDan]

Will post updates as the project progresses.

Some time back Cowboy shooters were doing something similar with the 45 Colt and shortening them to something similar to the 45 Schofield and had good results. I wish I could remember more details.

 

[Recoil45]

Still waiting on trimmers so I can play with some different loads.

Did the cheap shipping with the UPS/USPS hand off. Worst shipping method ever.

Used it three times to save money. The third time sucked just as bad as the first. Never again.

 

[Younggun]

Got my case trim gauges and shell holders in the mail today.

Took a little sand paper and a Dewalt drill to the 9mm case length gauge and got it turned down to fit the .357 mag cases.

Trimmed 3 down to length. Next step is to play with the .380 dies until I find he right setting to load the shortened cases.

 

[orbitup]

Rimmed 9mm.