Top Generals: Obama is purging the military.

[Shotgun Jeremy]

Downsizing of the military in general has been going on since the Bush era. The president has nothing to do with it. Also, military members are not supposed to speak poorly of their commander in chief-ESPECIALLY when in uniform. You may find enlisted guys who do that when in uniform. The ones that do are either unit dirtbags, or are speaking to you "off the record" as a personal friend. Officers are more heavily scrutinized for talk like that because they are required to set the example.

I'm a vet...so I'll say Obama needs to be impeached for being a no good, slimey, lying asshole. However when I was enlisted, I never would have put that on a public forum. Just because you don't say it-that don't mean you don't think it.

 

[JohnnyLobo]

You don't seem to have any, and you pressured him to tell you what his qualifications were, then claimed he should provide evidence of those qualifications. Now you say that by telling you what you had previously demanded he is somehow trying to throw right around.


This is why we are giving you so much shit. You are not debating anything, only stating your belief and saying everyone else loves Obama. You site your qualifications. As knowing people in the military and discount the views of those who comment and are or have served on the military. And you make a point to end every post with an insult, thinly veiled if your trying to look civil.

Unless you change your attitude your time on this forum will likely be very short lived. I also hope you choose a different tactic when speaking with those on the fence politically. The attitude you present can go a long ways towards pushing people to the left when we are working our asses off to bring them to the right.

First of all, he had already stated his credentials before I did that. Second, I wasn't even serious. Are you guys kidding me? I knew that would get some blood boiling. I only did that because he had already determined to be the authority on everything going on in the military, and though I don't discount what he says, and he very well might be right, I still find it intellectually dishonest to try to shut down a thread because he is the supposed expert and ignore the evidence and testimony of men whom I actually have some respect for, just because he seems to disagree with how they conducted themselves as generals, or the work of certain journalists, just because he disagrees with their conclusions.

 

[robertc1024]

GAAH - Just leave troll. Why did you want to "get some blood boiling?" How many of the "men whom I actually have some respect for" have you ever met? zero? Where in TX do you live? And if why not, why are you on here? Get your ass back to Kommiefornia or NJ if you're not too busy sucking up whatever Obamarama leaves out on the table.

 

[Younggun]

First of all, he had already stated his credentials before I did that. Second, I wasn't even serious. Are you guys kidding me? I knew that would get some blood boiling. I only did that because he had already determined to be the authority on everything going on in the military, and though I don't discount what he says, and he very well might be right, I still find it intellectually dishonest to try to shut down a thread because he is the supposed expert and ignore the evidence and testimony of men whom I actually have some respect for, just because he seems to disagree with how they conducted themselves as generals, or the work of certain journalists, just because he disagrees with their conclusions.

Do you even lift?

 

[shooterfpga]

Downsizing of the military in general has been going on since the Bush era. The president has nothing to do with it. Also, military members are not supposed to speak poorly of their commander in chief-ESPECIALLY when in uniform. You may find enlisted guys who do that when in uniform. The ones that do are either unit dirtbags, or are speaking to you "off the record" as a personal friend. Officers are more heavily scrutinized for talk like that because they are required to set the example.

I'm a vet...so I'll say Obama needs to be impeached for being a no good, slimey, lying $#@!. However when I was enlisted, I never would have put that on a public forum. Just because you don't say it-that don't mean you don't think it.

We arent even allowed to do it off duty. Many have been pushed out because of off line comments on facebook and other social media.

 

[Younggun]

I got in a little trouble while in the service over some comments I made.

 

[breakingcontact]

I got in a little trouble while in the service over some comments I made.

They just told us to not talk to reporters. We bitched about politicians all the time within our unit.

 

[Younggun]

They just told us to not talk to reporters. We bitched about politicians all the time within our unit.

If it had been a reporter or social media I probably would have gotten in to MUCH more trouble. I got away with some threats and the WO had me write a stupid ass essay an told me to out it on my wall. My squad leader came in and saw it and flipped out. Ripped it down and took off to have words with the WO, lol.

I was 19, stressed, and a little hot headed at the time, probably should not have been saying what I said and by the definition I WAS breaking the rules. Just not with the intent of what the WO was claiming.

 

[breakingcontact]

But wait...theres more!

http://mobile.wnd.com/2013/11/purge-surge-obama-fires-another-commander/#RW1aKck7e6qWWxzA.03

 

[Shotgun Jeremy]

I was at a protesting of the war protesters around 2004. Made it in the news around the country! The guys I was with and I all had a chat with the plt commander. He told us we were walking a fine line. On one hand, we were at a protest and in the media. On the other hand, we didn't make our govt affiliation known or down talk any govt officials. So we got let off with a warning followed by them wanting to hear about it off the record. Lol

 

[Shotgun Jeremy]

But wait...theres more!

http://mobile.wnd.com/2013/11/purge-surge-obama-fires-another-commander/#RW1aKck7e6qWWxzA.03

What ever happened with those generals he relieved for trying to send help to benghazi?

Nuff said.

 

[majormadmax]

What ever happened with those generals he relieved for trying to send help to benghazi?

Nuff said.

GEN Carter Ham? He finished out his two-year tour as commander of USAFRICOM and was followed by his deputy. Nothing out of the ordinary, but some people would like to make it out to be.

As for GEN Stanley McCrystal, he unfortunately criticized his chain-of-command in front of his staff and that made its way to a Rolling Stone reporter. If he were innocent of the allegations, he would have never apologized; but he got to retain his four-star rank in retirement despite not holding if for three years as usually required so if he was to be bitch-slapped, that wouldn't have happened.

And blaming Obama for a garrison commander's dismissal is ridiculous. What good would purging a colonel do for the president?

And don't forget USSTRATCOM Deputy Commander VADM Tim Giardina, relieved a month ago for passing counterfeit poker chips at a Council Bluffs casino last June! If that is the work of our current Commander-in-Chief, then I am extremely impressed that he has the ability to pull off such a ruse and get away with it!

Maj Gen Michael Carey, 20th Air Force Commander, was relieved due to alleged "Personal Misbehavior" during a TDY. Considering all the issues in the nuclear triad recently (launch officers dequalified at Minot, silo blast doors not being closed as required, Nuclear Surety Inspections being failed), I am honeslt surprised that we haven't seen more general and flag officers dismissed.

The bottom line is that there is usually more to the story than what some alarmists tend to tell. Many of these "purges" have logical explanations behind them, and others are simply made up (as is the case with Carter Ham).

 

[breakingcontact]

The AF officers should have been relieved for not running their nuclear unit right. MajorMadMax do you not agree high ranking officers are being relieved or otherwise forced to resign or retire at a near historic rate in the past 50 years?

Things that would have previously been cause for a letter of reprimand or other reassignment or quiet retirement are costing people their careers.

 

[Shotgun Jeremy]

GEN Carter Ham? He finished out his two-year tour as commander of USAFRICOM and was followed by his deputy. Nothing out of the ordinary, but some people would like to make it out to be.

As for GEN Stanley McCrystal, he unfortunately criticized his chain-of-command in front of his staff and that made its way to a Rolling Stone reporter. If he were innocent of the allegations, he would have never apologized; but he got to retain his four-star rank in retirement despite not holding if for three years as usually required so if he was to be bitch-slapped, that wouldn't have happened.

And blaming Obama for a garrison commander's dismissal is ridiculous. What good would purging a colonel do for the president?

And don't forget USSTRATCOM Deputy Commander VADM Tim Giardina, relieved a month ago for passing counterfeit poker chips at a Council Bluffs casino last June! If that is the work of our current Commander-in-Chief, then I am extremely impressed that he has the ability to pull off such a ruse and get away with it!

Maj Gen Michael Carey, 20th Air Force Commander, was relieved due to alleged "Personal Misbehavior" during a TDY. Considering all the issues in the nuclear triad recently (launch officers dequalified at Minot, silo blast doors not being closed as required, Nuclear Surety Inspections being failed), I am honeslt surprised that we haven't seen more general and flag officers dismissed.

The bottom line is that there is usually more to the story than what some alarmists tend to tell. Many of these "purges" have logical explanations behind them, and others are simply made up (as is the case with Carter Ham).

Fair enough. lol

 

[majormadmax]

The AF officers should have been relieved for not running their nuclear unit right. MajorMadMax do you not agree high ranking officers are being relieved or otherwise forced to resign or retire at a near historic rate in the past 50 years?

Things that would have previously been cause for a letter of reprimand or other reassignment or quiet retirement are costing people their careers.

No. Senior officers are being relieved of their duties and allowed to retire at the same rate that it usually occurs; but for some reason there's this big effort to try to blame Obama for it.

For example, in 2008 Secretary of the Air Force Michael Wynne and Chief of Staff of the Air Force Gen Mike Moseley were both relieved of their duties for numerous failures under their watch. The first was an unauthorized movemement of nuclear weapons aboard two B-52s that wasn't noticed until the aircraft landed at their destination. The second was for inappropriately steering a contract for the Thunderbirds (the USAF Aerial Demonstration Team) to a company owned by a retired two-star, and the third was the illegal transportation of nuclear fuses to Taiwan. Seems like justification enough, doesn't it?!?

In 1990, CSAF Gen Michael Dugan was dismissed by then SecDef Dick Cheney for simply telling reporters that the US planned to target Saddam Hussein, his family, and even his mistress in the First Gulf War.

So it's happened throughout history, even Douglas MacArthur was fired.

This feeble attempt to tie it directly to Obama is a joke. There is nothing to prove that he has any input into the dismissal of any of these officers, and further research shows that each is being disciplined for a specific reason of their own doing being it personal issues or failures in leadership.

By the way, none of the general/flag officers listed are losing their retirement as far as I know. nor are any of them being court-martialed. Figuring a four-star is limited by Level II of the Executive Schedule to a base pay of $14,975.10 a month, and that someone with 30 years service receives 75% of their base pay in retirement, these individuals are walking away with $11,231/month in retirement pay in addition to the lucrative jobs most get after leaving the service, so it's not really costing them that much, is it?

 

[breakingcontact]

You mentioned MacArthur... Thats why i previously mentioned "the last 50 years".

As far as people blaming Obama...he has done a lot to demoralize and harm the military so it is only fitting that people are suspicious about his interference in the careers of top officers.

Id like to read a real quantitative study on the manner.

So if its not him...are standards for performance and behavior increasing (unless a person is openly gay, they can get married in the chapel at West Point) or are the high ranking officers just ate up now?

 

[Younggun]

M3 is on the ball with this stuff it seems, but I will add that if they are drawing down numbers it only makes sense it would be easier to get booted out.

Just like a regular job, if the work load is high workers will probably get away with a few things without losing their jobs because they are already trained and their experience is needed. If the company is looking at layoffs and someone makes the same screw up it's much more likely for the company to terminate them.

 

[breakingcontact]

And why are they shrinking the size of the military?

 

[Shotgun Jeremy]

And why are they shrinking the size of the military?

As someone directly involved in this...twice-I'll tell you what was relayed to me and what I saw. In 2004, my chain of command started talking to us about a new higher-tenure program the military was switching to. They also warned us that downsizing was soon to follow. Sure enough, about 6 months later, word starts coming out that the Navy has enlisted too many people in the war effort so we're gonna start down sizing and re-purpousing (making new units to run convoys in the desert) people. First ones to go were the ones that couldn't pass weigh-in. Then it was the ones that couldn't pass PT. Then it was a combination of allowing people to voluntarily walk out and going after trouble makers. Then, they started offering early retirements for enlisted. After that, they just locked up advancements so people couldn't rank up and were forced out via higher-tenure. Right at the end of it all, they purged through everyone's records and if you had a troubled military past, you were up for board and they were straight up kicking good people out who had issues in the past.

After the Navy was winding down with cutbacks, the ARMY started backing out so they went through the same thing because we had all these guys on payroll and nowhere to send them. I don't know where they're at with it at this point, but as a civilian working for the ARMY, I saw extremely drastic cuts to the civilian force first, and the ARMY times was reporting the same things the Navy had started out with.

Now that we've cut all the enlisted, we don't need as many officers. They have shut down commands and some bases.

I wanna say Congress is behind all the cuts, but I'm not 100% sure.

I have no clue where the AirForce stands in all this.

 

[Younggun]

Yup, the draw shown on the military is nothing new. It was a big discussion and debate some year ago when Serious talks if exiting Iraq began. All grouped in with the costs of the war and sustaining such a large fighting force. Also talk of the increased use of drones and "smart weapons" meant larger fighting forces were no longer needed.

Not saying shrinking the military is right or wrong, we will find that out if shit gets crazy, just why it was happening.