Thinking about a rifle purchase

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  • Moonpie

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    Gunz are icky.
    Why has OP not posted pics of his new rifle?

    OP is a slacker!
     

    lonestardiver

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    From what I understand, you can reload it. It's just going to be ugly as sin and probably not last as long as brass fired in a normal chamber. The bigger issue is the gun beating the tar out of your brass when it ejects it. Thats if you can even find the brass after it chucks it into the next county. My Hakim is like that. It'll damn near rip the rim off the cartridge and before I added a leather buffer to the deflection bar, it would dent brass horribly. The dent would go halfway through the case. I'm working on trying to get it tamed down.

    Yes you can reload it....unless you blow the case back out to size you have reduced capacity. This may change your pressures and the resulting pressure curve.
     
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    zackmars

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    A 16" 5.56 is about as good as it gets for a general purpose carbine.

    The issue with the various PCC's out there is that its either a gussied up hi point, or costs over 1k.

    I urge you to try a PTR/Cetme rifle before you buy. They are ergonomic nightmares, and the combo of being roller delayed, and having the charging handle located so far forward makes it particularly unpleasant.

    Should you still want one, get a PTR instead of the century option. Better yet, get an FAL or AR10
     

    satx78247

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    A 16" 5.56 is about as good as it gets for a general purpose carbine.

    The issue with the various PCC's out there is that its either a gussied up hi point, or costs over 1k.

    I urge you to try a PTR/Cetme rifle before you buy. They are ergonomic nightmares, and the combo of being roller delayed, and having the charging handle located so far forward makes it particularly unpleasant.

    Should you still want one, get a PTR instead of the century option. Better yet, get an FAL or AR10


    zackmars,

    Better yet get a Remington pump rifle in 7.62 NATO/,308WCF that will accept M14 magazines.

    I shoot a PUMP about as fast as most people shoot an AR10, because pumping the action helps getting back on target.
    Further most Remington pumps w/scope are DEADLY accurate farther than you can see a deer/hog/axis on our farm or lease.

    FWIW, I agree with you on the German G3 & its cousins. NOT ergonomic for me.

    Personally, what I would really like is a PB BM59 Type 1 in 7.62x51mm & that takes either FAL or M14 magazines. = The Type 1 is essentially nothing more than a standard GARAND that will take a 20-round magazine & in 7.62NATO.
    (CANNOT afford one right now.)

    Fwiw, there is a smith in suburban Baton Rouge that you buy a complete BM59 kit, a Garand receiver & any other goodies that you want on your rifle& he will assemble it for you. = About 3-4 weeks later he will give you your completed rifle for 600-760.oo in labor.
    (the old Cajun does NICE work, btw & his conversions are HARD to tell from a rifle that came out of the Beretta shop.)

    just my OPINION, satx
     
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    Dougw1515

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    A 16" 5.56 is about as good as it gets for a general purpose carbine.

    The issue with the various PCC's out there is that its either a gussied up hi point, or costs over 1k.

    I urge you to try a PTR/Cetme rifle before you buy. They are ergonomic nightmares, and the combo of being roller delayed, and having the charging handle located so far forward makes it particularly unpleasant.

    Should you still want one, get a PTR instead of the century option. Better yet, get an FAL or AR10
    Problems are... I don't have a clue "... roller delayed"??? "... charging handle" ????

    don't want me no gussied up Hi Point!!!
     

    Axxe55

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    Problems are... I don't have a clue "... roller delayed"??? "... charging handle" ????

    don't want me no gussied up Hi Point!!!

    Doug, don't be so quick to dismiss the Hi-Point carbine. They are actually pretty solid performers, under most circumstances are reasonably priced and they have one of the best warranties in the gun industry. Great customer service as well.
     

    zackmars

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    Problems are... I don't have a clue "... roller delayed"??? "... charging handle" ????

    don't want me no gussied up Hi Point!!!

    Roller delayed is a type of operating system that the Germans were quite fond of from the middle days of WW2 to the 80's. Unlike most self loading rifles, the CETME/PTR/G3 does not use expanding gas to unlock a bolt, but rather a pure mechanical disadvantage to delay a bolt from opening to allow pressure built up in the case to dissapate (to a safe degree)

    On paper, this has the advantage of being able to operate in harsher conditions, be lighter, potentially more accurate

    In reality, it makes for a very brutish gun to both manipulate, and shoot.

    The charging handle, what you pull back on to open the bolt, is situated very far forward on the gun, and because there is no bolt hold open, you have to work the charging handle every time you reload
     

    zackmars

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    zackmars,

    Better yet get a Remington pump rifle in 7.62 NATO/,308WCF that will accept M14 magazines.

    I shoot a PUMP about as fast as most people shoot an AR10, because pumping the action helps getting back on target.
    Further most Remington pumps w/scope are DEADLY accurate farther than you can see a deer/hog/axis on our farm or lease.

    FWIW, I agree with you on the German G3 & its cousins. NOT ergonomic for me.

    Personally, what I would really like is a PB BM59 Type 1 in 7.62x51mm & that takes either FAL or M14 magazines. = The Type 1 is essentially nothing more than a standard GARAND that will take a 20-round magazine & in 7.62NATO.
    (CANNOT afford one right now.)

    Fwiw, there is a smith in suburban Baton Rouge that you buy a complete BM59 kit, a Garand receiver & any other goodies that you want on your rifle& he will assemble it for you. = About 3-4 weeks later he will give you your completed rifle for 600-760.oo in labor.
    (the old Cajun does NICE work, btw & his conversions are HARD to tell from a rifle that came out of the Beretta shop.)

    just my OPINION, satx

    One of the big arguments against the remington series of pump rifles is they are not much more than hunting rifles, they do not have the engineering of the G3, FAL, AR10, M1/BM59, or even the M14 behind them.

    Their parts will not hold up to the abuse a fighting rifles parts will, they will not last long once you use them to shoot more than a few times a year.

    And while you might be able to shoot one quickly, that increase in rate of fire dissapears once you get into unconventional posistions. There is a reason why pump actions didn't see widespread adoption in militaries looking for repeaters. And there is the further issue of making the shooter do more work, or letting the gun do it. I'd rather have the gun do as much of the work as possible

    BM59's are neat, but I don't think the Garand action meshes well with detachable box magazines
     

    Dougw1515

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    Roller delayed is a type of operating system that the Germans were quite fond of from the middle days of WW2 to the 80's. Unlike most self loading rifles, the CETME/PTR/G3 does not use expanding gas to unlock a bolt, but rather a pure mechanical disadvantage to delay a bolt from opening to allow pressure built up in the case to dissapate (to a safe degree)

    On paper, this has the advantage of being able to operate in harsher conditions, be lighter, potentially more accurate

    In reality, it makes for a very brutish gun to both manipulate, and shoot.

    The charging handle, what you pull back on to open the bolt, is situated very far forward on the gun, and because there is no bolt hold open, you have to work the charging handle every time you reload
    You do realize you're talking about guns on TGT. I think that's not allowed but don't quote me on that.

    OK... so I'm learning some things. What alternative is there yanking the charging handle on a reload? On my pistols I have to rack the slid on a reload, or activate the slide stop. That kinna sounds like pulling back on the charging handle. Do some rifles automatically chamber a round when a new magazine is inserted?
     

    zackmars

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    You do realize you're talking about guns on TGT. I think that's not allowed but don't quote me on that.

    OK... so I'm learning some things. What alternative is there yanking the charging handle on a reload? On my pistols I have to rack the slid on a reload, or activate the slide stop. That kinna sounds like pulling back on the charging handle. Do some rifles automatically chamber a round when a new magazine is inserted?

    Imagine if your pistol didn't lock open upon firing the last shot, so instead of having to yank it back like 1/4 of an inch, you have to pull it back all the way.

    And since the gun is in .308 instead of a pistol caliber, everything is longer, heavier, generally less pleasant
     

    Dougw1515

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    Imagine if your pistol didn't lock open upon firing the last shot, so instead of having to yank it back like 1/4 of an inch, you have to pull it back all the way.

    And since the gun is in .308 instead of a pistol caliber, everything is longer, heavier, generally less pleasant
     

    Axxe55

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    You do realize you're talking about guns on TGT. I think that's not allowed but don't quote me on that.

    OK... so I'm learning some things. What alternative is there yanking the charging handle on a reload? On my pistols I have to rack the slid on a reload, or activate the slide stop. That kinna sounds like pulling back on the charging handle. Do some rifles automatically chamber a round when a new magazine is inserted?

    I think the biggest disadvantage is the position you have to be in to the charging handle. On an AR, the bolt release it right at your fingertips and easy to operate.
     

    Dougw1515

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    Imagine if your pistol didn't lock open upon firing the last shot, so instead of having to yank it back like 1/4 of an inch, you have to pull it back all the way.

    And since the gun is in .308 instead of a pistol caliber, everything is longer, heavier, generally less pleasant
    Got'cha
     

    zackmars

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    The PTR/G3 does have some good things going for it though.

    Good sights, cheap magazines, and it is quite modular. And its by far the cheapest of the "big 3" out there


    I still think the FAL is superior though
     

    Axxe55

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    The PTR/G3 does have some good things going for it though.

    Good sights, cheap magazines, and it is quite modular. And its by far the cheapest of the "big 3" out there


    I still think the FAL is superior though

    When you get into the "larger" battle rifles, ( I think that's the correct term) there are some really good ones available.

    But that comes at a sacrifice of carrying more weight.

    My all time personal favorite, the M1A. But it's almost twice the weight of my AR's. Great rifle, solid, well made, quite accurate, but heavy.
     

    Dougw1515

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    What was Rittenhouse toting? It seemed quite capable.

    ETA: I'm not really interested in a big heavy battle rifle. Accurate out to 100 yards. Mag fed. preferably 20 round capacity. semi-auto, red dot or scope(co-witness ability) if that's possible. good knock down stay down ability.
     
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