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Texas Lt. Gov. Dan Patrick says Senate currently lacks the votes to pass permitless carry

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  • Renegade

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    Looks like 46.035 is gone and those places are now prohibited where before some needed 30.06 to be prohibited via (I)

    this bill is crazy complex. I can’t see how people who would not get a LTC are going to take the time to learn all the prohibited places and such
     

    Renegade

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    You aren’t thinking hard enough. Scenario: 30.05 only posted at a business; LTC open carries inside. What happens next? Why is DtP and not an exception problematic for the LTC holder?

    30.06/30.07 posted business. Can a non-LTC legally enter if 30.05 is not posted? Is that person legal?

    These are not edge cases.
    This also one of the biggest gotchas. Different rules and penalties depending on how you carry and who you are.

    Two people enter a posted business,both are caught. The LTC walks out with Class C ticket, the nonLTCwalks out in cuffs and a Class A.
    And then there are the non-LEOs LTCs who are mostly exempt like judges DAs etc
     

    Sasquatch

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    This also one of the biggest gotchas. Different rules and penalties depending on how you carry and who you are.

    Two people enter a posted business,both are caught. The LTC walks out with Class C ticket, the nonLTCwalks out in cuffs and a Class A.
    And then there are the non-LEOs LTCs who are mostly exempt like judges DAs etc

    Rules for thee but not for me, embodied. We should all - off-duty cops, judges, DA's, and everyday tax paying people - be under one set of rules. If I can't carry in a courtroom, neither should the judge or DA. Their lives are no more important than mine.
     

    billtool

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    This also one of the biggest gotchas. Different rules and penalties depending on how you carry and who you are.

    Two people enter a posted business,both are caught. The LTC walks out with Class C ticket, the nonLTCwalks out in cuffs and a Class A.
    And then there are the non-LEOs LTCs who are mostly exempt like judges DAs etc
    Another gotcha that is a poor holdover from the previous LTC law is the intoxication piece. Most of us agree that getting shitfaced and stumbling around public places while armed minimally shows poor ambassadorship from a 2A supporter, and worst case alcohol judgement takes over and one becomes a idiot with a gun. The LEO’s subjective estimation of intoxication has always disturbed me. Wish this was tied to an objective measurement.
     

    TexasRedneck

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    Wiliamr

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    Yessir...and when you get the law degree needed to fully dissect it, gimme a holler! LOL We complain about the complexity of the language, but as a practical matter it HAS to be to stand up in a court.
    Well aren't we snarky? How do you know I don't have a JD?
    I was attempting to pass along the fact it has been posted here.
     

    cycleguy2300

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    Not according to quite a few folks on this forum.
    Courts have always held homes to have the highest level of privacy. Public spaces, though private property (Wal-Mart, Lowes, &c) have always been held to have a much lower standard of privacy. Just like your vehicle has a lower standard of privacy than your home, person or even cell phone.

    Actually sitting in a case law class right now and just went over all this.

    Sent from your mom's house using Tapatalk
     

    cycleguy2300

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    Another gotcha that is a poor holdover from the previous LTC law is the intoxication piece. Most of us agree that getting shitfaced and stumbling around public places while armed minimally shows poor ambassadorship from a 2A supporter, and worst case alcohol judgement takes over and one becomes a idiot with a gun. The LEO’s subjective estimation of intoxication has always disturbed me. Wish this was tied to an objective measurement.
    Fwiw, most I know LEO's will use their discretion and avoid charging a person with UCW for a PI unless the firearm was directly involved in the PI.

    "Drunk" is one thing, but to be PI means a danger to one's self or another due to your intoxication. It's a pretty low bar and easy to articulate, but it is a tool to solve a problem, and shouldn't be (and generally isnt) used as a catch-all.

    Sent from your mom's house using Tapatalk
     

    rotor

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    rotor,

    While a merchant/private property owner has the RIGHT to prohibit bearing arms on their premises, I have the RIGHT to avoid them as if they are giving away free cases of the Plague. = All they have to do to ASSURE that I will NOT go there is post the signs on their property.

    FYI, the last time that I bought new tires for the Town Car, I went to a GOODYEAR store that had 3006/3007 signs.

    After spending over 600.oo at another vendor, I mailed a copy of the receipt for the tires to the MGR at GOODYEAR, with a note on the receipt that I would never spend another penny at their store UNTIL/UNLESS they STARTED SUPPORTING the 2nd Amendment & allowed firearms.

    Two days later, I passed by the GOODYEAR store (on the way to HEB) & the signs were G-O-N-E, GONE.

    yours, satx






    rotor,

    I know ZILCH about the 3005 situation. ========> To ME alone, such a sign means that the merchant doesn't want my business & I will happily go elsewhere to spend my $$$$$$.

    yours, satx
    I agree totally.
     

    ralewis

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    There is a difference between private property like your home and private property open to the public.
    Yes. You can't discriminate against a federally (or state) protected class on private property open to the public. Gun owners are not a protected class, so legally I think it's perfectly ok to exclude and discriminate.
     

    Renegade

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    Yessir...and when you get the law degree needed to fully dissect it, gimme a holler! LOL We complain about the complexity of the language, but as a practical matter it HAS to be to stand up in a court.

    No it is complex because of all the prohibitions they added and all the new penalties, new signs, etc.

    They could have just repealed the portions 46.02 that relate to handguns and we would have had CC. Instead we have this. Of course that would not have passed so we get all these special interest prohibitions.

    and then there is the practical. If places start putting up 30.05/06/07 signs we will have lost a lot of ground. So it a big unknown at this time
     
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