Tacticool vs knowing your stuff

[V-Tach]

I just wish some one would make a full size pistol in .25 acp with a 50 round capacity......

 

[SIG_Fiend]

Those huge cavitation channels you see are from rifle rounds. Pistols just don't have the velocity needed to do that sort of damage. Maybe 22tcm or 5.7...

Yeah, and never mind the copious amounts of documented cases of people taking multiple rifle rounds (sometimes .30cal+), sometimes in the dozens, surviving, and sometimes even continuing to fight through it...

So 1/10 of an inch makes a difference.....and yet people still don't even regularly measure themselves against a shot timer? LOL

 

[Mexican_Hippie]

Tomahawk wounds and much worse than pistol wounds. Just sayin...

;-)

 

[ZX9RCAM]

All this, and...

View attachment 36746

Somebody mind explaining to an idjit what the percentages are percentages of, lol?

 

[Mexican_Hippie]

Somebody mind explaining to an idjit what the percentages are percentages of, lol?

Percentages of how awesome they are compared to 40SW. They just set 40 as the benchmark and worked it relative from there looks like.

 

[Countryfried Frank]

If that's the case, where would 10mm be of it were on that list?

 

[Mexican_Hippie]

If that's the case, where would 10mm be of it were on that list?

120%?

 

[ZX9RCAM]

Percentages of how awesome they are compared to 40SW. They just set 40 as the benchmark and worked it relative from there looks like.

Ah, thanks!

No wonder I carry a .40, lol.....

 

[StevenC.]

Somebody mind explaining to an idjit what the percentages are percentages of, lol?

Remember being graded on a curve?

 

[StevenC.]

needs quote

 

[StevenC.]

If that's the case, where would 10mm be of it were on that list?

Still irrelevent

 

[seeker_two]

Percentages of how awesome they are compared to 40SW. They just set 40 as the benchmark and worked it relative from there looks like.

Did Marshall and Sanow even calculate awesomeness in their stopping power statistics?

 

[StevenC.]

Well, a 185gr .45 ACP will leave a permanent wound channel with about a 1.5" diameter and a good 7-8" in depth. That doesn't include the temporary cavity created upon impact that collapses into this permanent channel.

Actually, it doesn't. Permanent wound channel is actual tissue destroyed. I'm confident that a .45" bullet have never expanded to over 3x original size.

.45 don't carry enough energy to create radial tear in the human body. Radial tearing has only been observed at velocity over 1500 fps; the cited 1200 fps isn't fast enough.

Luckygunner's published data shows us that 185 grn .45 when performing properly average .65" and penetrate 15.9". If you include the rounds which did not expanded the average diameter shrinks to .55" and penetration extends to 20.4" average.

When you look at the total mass of luckygunners data, properly performing bullets look like this:

	9mm	.40 S&W	.45 ACP
Dia	0.59	0.69	0.66
Pen	16.9	15.6	16.0
Volume	4.59	5.83	5.49

Those differences aren't even worth considering.

As SIG-fiend has been trying to say, SHOOTING ABILITY MATTERS MOST.

 

[StevenC.]

Percentages of how awesome they are compared to 40SW. They just set 40 as the benchmark and worked it relative from there looks like.

Pretty much. I had to start someplace to provide context. Using .40 with the largest KE I graded the others on a curve.

In this case I am discussing recoil and using KE as a loose standard for what the shooter feels when firing the gun. Since they all largely produce a similar level of energy it helps them to understand why each produces a similar result in the body (each expands out to within .10" of each other, each penetrates at least 12" (FBI min.))

 

[ZX9RCAM]

Remember being graded on a curve?

Well, it's been over 30yrs. since my last College class, but yes.
But that does not help answer my question though.

Is it indeed a comparison to .40S&W??


ETA: posted before your last comment was seen by myself, question answered.

 

[TX69]

Yeah, and never mind the copious amounts of documented cases of people taking multiple rifle rounds (sometimes .30cal+), sometimes in the dozens, surviving, and sometimes even continuing to fight through it...

So 1/10 of an inch makes a difference.....and yet people still don't even regularly measure themselves against a shot timer? LOL

This^^ Where's the story about the cop that shot up a perp some 20 + times with a 9mm or a 40 and the dude kept on coming. I think at the end of the story he was carrying a 45? A few years ago I sold of my 9's and bought 45's. From that point I worked on finding the best defense ammunition for the pistols that we shoot. I went with the largest grain weight and fastest bullet we could handle. My wife likes the 230gr HST where I like the 230gr +p HST as I can control the extra muzzle flip from the extra charge. My wife and I are shooters but we are definitely not on the scale of shooters that are tacticool with their shooting. I am better at the basics but I teach my wife shot placement over and over again. She is a better shot than me but not under stress. She has agreed to go to take some courses but I have yet to find any in the Metroplex that we would take?

 

[Mexican_Hippie]

Shots on target, at speed, is the #1 factor, outside of avoiding the situation of course.

Caliber, meh

 

[StevenC.]

^^^ that

 

[jrbfishn]

My Pop gave me good advice long ago.
No matter what you are shooting at, no matter with what, no matter what happens, make every shot count. You may not get another

from an idgit coffeeholic

 

[TheDan]

Shots on target, at speed, is the #1 factor, outside of avoiding the situation of course.

Caliber, meh

I took a co-worker shooting that hadn't ever been before. He took to the MkIII like a duck to water. By the end of the day he was doing rapid mag dumps into the head of the target in about 3" groups. Yeah, I think that would do the job even with .22