Got a light bearing holster today, and...

[Medic218]

Do light bearing holsters normally have this much of a gap around the trigger guard?
This can't be right....
I can still get my finger in there enough to pull the trigger once it's fully seated.

 

[Jigo23]

Ummm, no. Either the wrong holster for the gun or a very poorly made one. I wouldn’t use it, kinda defeats the purpose of even having a holster?

 

[candcallen]

Let's see...I know of about a half dozen police officers who had guns go off in holsters like that. Keys shirt tails and even pencils have gotten in there and upon standing sitting or taking a shirt off bang.

Some early AR mounts had similar issues with one motorcycle cop having a kid in school fire his AR while doing a show n tell kinda thing. Little fingers got near the trigger.

Triggers should always be 100 percent covered, especially in single action or striker fired guns


I would return or destroy that. I promise you that at some point something will get in there.

Secondly why a light on the gun? I guarantee you that you will break a couple rules using that. Is the risk worth the tactical advantage?

Just a thought.

 

[zackmars]

Let's see...I know of about a half dozen police officers who had guns go off in holsters like that. Keys shirt tails and even pencils have gotten in there and upon standing sitting or taking a shirt off bang.

Some early AR mounts had similar issues with one motorcycle cop having a kid in school fire his AR while doing a show n tell kinda thing. Little fingers got near the trigger.

Triggers should always be 100 percent covered, especially in single action or striker fired guns


I would return or destroy that. I promise you that at some point something will get in there.

Secondly why a light on the gun? I guarantee you that you will break a couple rules using that. Is the risk worth the tactical advantage?

Just a thought.

A WML is not a flashlight. It is not to be used as such.

 

[zackmars]

Some do, some don't. Light bearing safariland 6378's have this issue, but safariland 7TS light bearings don't.

 

[candcallen]

A WML is not a flashlight. It is not to be used as such.

Thus the question. 98 percent of people use it as a light, even those trained properly have bad habbits.

 

[SlimJim]

A WML is a WML so I would imagine there is a use for a WML to properly identify targets?

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[zackmars]

Thus the question. 98 percent of people use it as a light, even those trained properly have bad habbits.

Bad habits is a gross overstatement.

It is not a flashlight. Thinking it is, is negligent.

Also, i don't belive your "98%" bit. Do you have any basis or experience to say that? I've done a low light class, and the first thing you do is learn what not to do

 

[candcallen]

No not a gross overstatement. Most think it's a flashlight and forget it's attached to a weapon.

I wont even get into minimally trained and inexperienced people operating things with their trigger fingers under stress.

Experience? A little bit more than your class.

A seperate light is always better. You do what you think is best.

 

[zackmars]

No not a gross overstatement. Most think it's a flashlight and forget it's attached to a weapon.

I wont even get into minimally trained and inexperienced people operating things with their trigger fingers under stress.

Experience? A little bit more than your class.

A seperate light is always better. You do what you think is best.

Cool, so do you have anything to add to the thread, or...?

 

[candcallen]

Cool, so do you have anything to add to the thread, or...?

Since you have been thru a class you obviously know all there is to know about the subject.

I'm sure they taught you people revert to familiarity under stress which is why people forget their light is attached to a gun and why using you trigger finger to flip light switches isnt smart for the same reason.

Like I said the risk is yours. You do what you think is best.

 

[Hoji]

Candcallen is absolutely correct. Hell, even most of the leo I know don’t use them correctly and this is due to not having enough actual training with how to properly use them. I have taken several classes on low light shooting. They were fun classes, and I learned a lot, but at the end of the day, a weapon mounted light is not something I feel that would give me any sort of advantage in anything I am likely to encounter in the real world that a SureFire defender wouldn’t work for.

100% of the folks in the classes I have been in ( both LE and non LE) began the class using them as a flashlight. Unless you can regularly live fire train in the proper use of these lights, you will revert back to what is comfortable to you and start using them as flashlights again

 

[candcallen]

Candcallen is absolutely correct. Hell, even most of the leo I know don’t use them correctly and this is due to not having enough actual training with how to properly use them. I have taken several classes on low light shooting. They were fun classes, and I learned a lot, but at the end of the day, a weapon mounted light is not something I feel that would give me any sort of advantage in anything I am likely to encounter in the real world that a SureFire defender wouldn’t work for.

100% of the folks in the classes I have been in ( both LE and non LE) began the class using them as a flashlight. Unless you can regularly live fire train in the proper use of these lights, you will revert back to what is comfortable to you and start using them as flashlights again

I will say, I taught officers in my classes there are 3 times/situations where a gun mounted light is acceptable. 1 On a long gun clearing room/houses with proper techniques, 2 The shield man on an entry team...which we didnt use and 3 our dog handlers, again with proper techniques. Basically when that weak hand is otherwise occupied by a primary job.

As I said, even those well trained people usually revert to using it as a flash light even though they were taught all the light casting and movement techniques and practice regularly.

Watch any police show on tv and you will see this.

Non LEOs will rarely if ever be in those situations with the exception of a long gun in home defense.

The negatives of a handgun mounted light far outweighs any tactical advantage. Room clearing should never be done ALONE or in a HURRY. Except under the most dire circumstances, that means at home too. I say this referencing home defense arguments.
Even then having that light anchored to the weapon isnt an advantage if you're doing it wrong, and it clearly shows where you are and where your weapon is pointed. Again why you dont do this stuff alone.

Also remember, since most people arent trained AND PRACTICED enough not to forget, that forgetting there is actually a gun there and then pointing your weapon at people isnt the best practice. We all know the justification for such things. Because your light is attached to your weapon and you forgot isnt one of them.

Yes even LEOs point their weapons at people much too often in my opinion.

Again I will add that using your trigger finger to do anything under stress is screaming for a bad outcome. Like hitting the gas instead of the brake cause you are too lazy to listen to people telling you not you drive with 2 feet your whole life. That one time you revert to muscle memory in high stress incidents it would suck that you pull the trigger instead of activating your light or laser.

As I said before you all do what you think is best, but do so with a full understanding of what can happen and why.

 

[Hoji]

.Even then having that light anchored to the weapon isnt an advantage if you're doing it wrong, and it clearly shows where you are and where your weapon is pointed.

Also gives a bad guy a pretty good idea where your head is.

 

[SlimJim]

Here I thought he was asking about a holster and not asking about the proper use of a WML? I bought a IWB holster off Amazon for a G19 with an OLight and it works great and trigger is covered.

With flashlights and a WML, two is one and one is none or so the mantra goes.

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[candcallen]

We did answer you question first.

You're welcome. Lol

 

[oldag]

Cool, so do you have anything to add to the thread, or...?

And your post brings to mind the exact same question.

 

[Petetothemax]

No not a gross overstatement. Most think it's a flashlight and forget it's attached to a weapon.

I wont even get into minimally trained and inexperienced people operating things with their trigger fingers under stress.

Experience? A little bit more than your class.

A seperate light is always better. You do what you think is best.

I use my WML as a back up to my surefire handheld flashlight. What if you drop or lose grip of the flashlight in some other way once engaged? I don't ask that sarcastically. Seriously asking.

 

[Sasquatch]

It depends on the light you're mounting, but yes, its' quite common for holsters, especially kydex holsters, to have a gap like that for a weapon mounted light. Think about it - you've got a light that is fatter than the trigger guard, mounted under the muzzle of the gun.

If the trigger guard was molded in like on a NON-light bearing holster, you'll never get a light in there, and if you did, you're not getting that gun/light out, at least without damaging the holster, the light, or both.

WML holsters will also typically provide retention based on the light, the ejection port, or through tension all around the contact surface of the gun, instead of off the trigger guard like a non-light bearing holster would.

The solution is running a skinner, flatter light. The Sure Fire 300, the older M series, the TLR series of lights are all round tubes that bolt on in front of skinny rectangles, so you're going to get trigger guard space issues. Yes, you can get a finger in there, or a shirt tail, jacket tail, stick, rocks, mud, dirt, or three body glitter covered midgets. Carrying a WML comes with pluses and minuses - like Paul Harrell says, you be the judge on if the pluses outweigh the minuses. I've carried and made holsters just like that - I used to tote a TLR-1 on either a Glock or an M&P - I like the light, I like the option of the light if I need to blind or disorient a bad guy, but they're bulky, they're harder to conceal, and in the end I would rather put a light on my home defense rifles and shotguns, and keep the pistol light-free. My EDC load out includes a flashlight and I feel better using the Harries' technique for situations where I'm needing both a gun and a flashlight in my hands, and I don't have my rifle handy. YMMV.