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  • Do you have LTC/carry/shooting insurance?

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    Wallace Dunn

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    Jan 22, 2020
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    Odessa, TX
    That case hasn’t gone to trial, so no evidence has been presented.

    ETA: the DA is accused of tampering w/APD witnesses to the Grand Jury over that indictment.

    I wasn't aware of the tampering allegation. Thanks for sharing that.
    Hurley's Gold
     

    billtool

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    4   0   0
    Nov 16, 2008
    4,095
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    The Wooldlands
    I’ll tell y’all- CCW Safe is the way to go. Been with them for many years and have a killer grandfathered deal. What they offer is objectively superior to what’s offered elsewhere…at least with my 10 year old, maintained, coverage plan.
     

    kenboyles72

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    Oct 15, 2017
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    Gladewater,TX
    This is one of those clever counter-points that some like to use. Just like using the position of only using factory ammo, or the same ammo that LE uses if you happened to be arrested on a self-defense type shooting situation.

    Many times in the past, I have brought these counter-points up. A justified and righteous self defense shooting is just that. The ammo used is irrelevant, as are the weapon used. What people say on any social media is protected by the 1st Amendment last I checked.

    A counter-point I have used is this. If you are sitting in a court of law, charged with a crime because of "supposed" self-defense shooting, it is because the LE officers didn't believe your story and the facts and evidence didn't line up with your version of the story. Which means a prosecutor didn't believe your story, and the grand jury didn't believe your story, and now, you have to convince a judge and jury of your story.

    So if you have made the journey from that point to the courtroom, it is quite possible they may drag anything and everything into court to discredit you and prove their case I suppose.

    Now if you have some actual court cases, and the dispositions, and verdicts of those cases to prove your assertion, I'm sure many of us would like to see them.


    Most quality Instructors teach "shoot to stop the THREAT." Never "shoot to kill." Be aware any and all comments on social media can, and HAVE been used against defendants in court.


    My instructor said the same, but in a different way. Yes, when you have to defend yourself, you do so till the threat is stopped. Sometimes this only takes drawing your firearm and telling them to back away, sometimes it means that you may have to put a whole mag into the perp. Now comes intent. Did you intend to kill or just stop the threat? There is a big difference, whether you think so or not. When you drew and intended to kill, that is premeditated murder. If you drew your weapon in defense and ended up killing, cause of where you shot or how many rounds you fired to actually stop the threat, without the sole intention to kill, then that is justified defense.

    If or when you get into a defensive shooting and say "I shot till he was dead" or "I wanted to kill him for trying to kill me" or any other statement as such, that is clear intent to kill other than just defending yourself. This statements will be used against you, to prove that you are guilty of murder, not defending yourself. So yeah, this is just not a clever counter-point and if one does end up in court, most of the time it is what the defendant said at the time of initial contact by LEO. Maybe you didn't mean what you said, but all that adrenaline rushing through your head makes on say shit you don't mean. But you did say it, now it is used against you, which is why you are standing before a jury trying to convince them you are innocent.
     

    rotor

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    Nov 1, 2015
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    Texas
    My instructor said the same, but in a different way. Yes, when you have to defend yourself, you do so till the threat is stopped. Sometimes this only takes drawing your firearm and telling them to back away, sometimes it means that you may have to put a whole mag into the perp. Now comes intent. Did you intend to kill or just stop the threat? There is a big difference, whether you think so or not. When you drew and intended to kill, that is premeditated murder. If you drew your weapon in defense and ended up killing, cause of where you shot or how many rounds you fired to actually stop the threat, without the sole intention to kill, then that is justified defense.

    If or when you get into a defensive shooting and say "I shot till he was dead" or "I wanted to kill him for trying to kill me" or any other statement as such, that is clear intent to kill other than just defending yourself. This statements will be used against you, to prove that you are guilty of murder, not defending yourself. So yeah, this is just not a clever counter-point and if one does end up in court, most of the time it is what the defendant said at the time of initial contact by LEO. Maybe you didn't mean what you said, but all that adrenaline rushing through your head makes on say shit you don't mean. But you did say it, now it is used against you, which is why you are standing before a jury trying to convince them you are innocent.
    First, as you know you never make any statements. But realistically to shoot until the threat is over has more to it than that. Are you going to aim for the legs? We are taught to shoot center body mass, and that is most likely a kill shot. So basically, just like the cops, we are taught that if we use our weapon it is likely going to be a kill shot and if the bad guy survives it is luck. Do we keep shooting kill shots once the threat is stopped, no. But they are kill shots.
     

    Wallace Dunn

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    Jan 22, 2020
    55
    11
    Odessa, TX
    First, as you know you never make any statements. But realistically to shoot until the threat is over has more to it than that. Are you going to aim for the legs? We are taught to shoot center body mass, and that is most likely a kill shot. So basically, just like the cops, we are taught that if we use our weapon it is likely going to be a kill shot and if the bad guy survives it is luck. Do we keep shooting kill shots once the threat is stopped, no. But they are kill shots.
    Any gun shot is lethal force. It's the luck of the draw if they survive or not. Even shots to the leg can be deadly.
     
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