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Costco. Good outcome thanks to a good-guy with a gun.

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  • txinvestigator

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    "A-hole cop shoots non-verbal mentally disabled man and his parents..."
    https://www.latimes.com/local/lanow...r-intellectual-disability-20190616-story.html
    One of the postings I saw elsewhere said they got into a confrontation over the last of an item that was in stock, and the cop pulled his piece and started shooting. I guess he went to the same school Ass-evado attended!

    Eli

    So nothing publicly reported indicated the "cop pulled his piece and started shooting" over a simple confrontation, but you are going to automatically assume that and the cop is an ahole?

    Good grief, man
     

    Sublime

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    Actually Eli's version is more plausible than my version so yeah, that is probably how it happened. Dang a..hole cops always shooting people after pulling their piece. Whachagonnado?
     

    Dad_Roman

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    Yep thats what happened. Cop wanted that last box of cheerios baaaad so he pulled his weapon and shot everybody within 10 feet!

    Thats life, right?
     

    Eli

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    So nothing publicly reported indicated the "cop pulled his piece and started shooting" over a simple confrontation, but you are going to automatically assume that and the cop is an ahole?

    Good grief, man

    Let's see: Off-duty LAPD cop shot an UNARMED 32-year-old non-verbal mentally incapacitated man, his UNARMED 58-year-old father, and his UNARMED mother in the middle of a crowded store. Why? Supposedly over the last rotisserie chicken!
    Then, after the fact, officer a-hole claims he was defending his child, which he was carrying? Seriously? You got into a fatal confrontation while carrying your kid?
    I really want to see the surveillance video!

    Eli
     

    toddnjoyce

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    Let's see: ...32-year-old non-verbal mentally incapacitated man...
    Eli

    “Kenneth French could drive and cook himself breakfast and sometimes held down part-time jobs, but was unable to live on his own, Shureih said. He was unsure of Kenneth French’s exact disability.”

    Playing Devil’s advocate here. Mental illness and not disability may be an issue here.

    OTOH, Having several extended family members with Down’s syndrome and numerous close friends with children across the autism spectrum, it’s also not inconceivable that an unprovoked physical altercation occurred. Many of them are very deliberate about when and where the people the give care for are taken in public, precisely to prevent or mitigate something like this occurring.

    I can envision several scenarios where seemingly innocent actions by the deceased and the parents that got shot could be perceived as a threat or an actual threat.
     

    txinvestigator

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    Let's see: Off-duty LAPD cop shot an UNARMED 32-year-old non-verbal mentally incapacitated man, his UNARMED 58-year-old father, and his UNARMED mother in the middle of a crowded store. Why? Supposedly over the last rotisserie chicken!
    Then, after the fact, officer a-hole claims he was defending his child, which he was carrying? Seriously? You got into a fatal confrontation while carrying your kid?
    I really want to see the surveillance video!

    Eli

    Ask me how I know you have ever dealt with EDPs. I have dealt with them who you cannot tell they are "mentally incapacitated" while they are trying to rip your head off or take your gun.
     

    jrbfishn

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    I have worked around the public most of my life. Almost 20 years at Walmart. I see folks with all kinds of mental disabilities on a daily basis. Most like him are some of the nicest folks you will ever encounter. Most of the time.

    Mentality of a teenager. And we know how unstable that can be.
    The body of a full grown man.
    Article says his mental capacity has degraded in recent years.
    I am not a mental health expert but I have seen quite a few just like him suddenly just go off and get quite violent. Why? Sometimes the trigger is apparent. Sometimes, you just stand there thinking WTF!!!????
    Why is of little matter at this point. Whether the deceased wanted to be first in line or the cop got the last chicken or the kid was crying, whatever, is a moot point.
    Mentally challenged or not, if you attack me with a child in my arms, you are on dangerous ground.
    Possible scenario according to the info in the articles; cop holding baby, apparent grown man in a group of three suddenly gets verbal. You try to de-escalate. Guy gets physical. Cop draws gun because he can't effectively fend off attacker holding the child hoping attacker backs off. Two others in the group seem to be joining the attack. There now seem to be THREE violent attackers endangering the child.
    Anyone that thinks:
    A: you are realistically going to fight them with your hands only and come out on top;
    Or B: it's only physical, cop and child will be ok.
    You are probably delusional. It takes a LOT less physical damage and strength to kill or maim that child than an adult. IIRC, being beaten to death is one of the top ways for kids under 5 years old to die other than illness. Wildcat Diva would probably have more knowledge on that than I.

    Dad may have only had a second or two at most to decide. Protect my child or shoot until the threat is gone.
    Bad situation all around? Without a doubt.

    If I was the cop, or as a civilan, in that situation, yup, your all dead.

    Now,,, how many times have we all discussed WHY we carry and how we never know where or how the threat to our selves or a family member will come from?
    Makes you think

    Sent by an idjit coffeeholic from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk
     

    jrbfishn

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    Ask me how I know you have ever dealt with EDPs. I have dealt with them who you cannot tell they are "mentally incapacitated" while they are trying to rip your head off or take your gun.
    This actually happened to me at the Walmart sporting goods where I work.

    Two guys, 50's or so, fairly regular customers. Both I believe are vets. Never any problem. In the store shopping one day.
    Young couple also shopping with an infant about a year old or so. Baby is tired and cranky, starts crying.
    Vet 1, goes off. Starts yelling at parents and baby. Vet 2, who is open carrying, backs off a few feet and starts smiling. Dad gets defensive and mom is trying her best to get away. Vet 1 follows while getting louder and acts like he will escalate. I manage to get between them and allow parents to escape his tirade. When vet 1 sees that I am not afraid of either of them, he starts to calm down.

    Vet 2 works at a local gun store. I talked to him later. They are deranged bullies.
    Vet one does this quite often. He then claims PTSD. Vet two is there not to calm his buddy or keep him from getting too violent. He is there with his gun to protect his buddy.

    To see them most of the time you would never guess, I did not for years, that that is what they do.

    Sent by an idjit coffeeholic from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk
     

    BuzzinSATX

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    This actually happened to me at the Walmart sporting goods where I work.

    Two guys, 50's or so, fairly regular customers. Both I believe are vets. Never any problem. In the store shopping one day.
    Young couple also shopping with an infant about a year old or so. Baby is tired and cranky, starts crying.
    Vet 1, goes off. Starts yelling at parents and baby. Vet 2, who is open carrying, backs off a few feet and starts smiling. Dad gets defensive and mom is trying her best to get away. Vet 1 follows while getting louder and acts like he will escalate. I manage to get between them and allow parents to escape his tirade. When vet 1 sees that I am not afraid of either of them, he starts to calm down.

    Vet 2 works at a local gun store. I talked to him later. They are deranged bullies.
    Vet one does this quite often. He then claims PTSD. Vet two is there not to calm his buddy or keep him from getting too violent. He is there with his gun to protect his buddy.

    To see them most of the time you would never guess, I did not for years, that that is what they do.

    Sent by an idjit coffeeholic from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk
    Wow! Vet or no Vet, I would have probably called cops, probably after the conversation. Hard to tell not being in your shoes...so maybe not. That is definitely a dangerous situation.
     

    jrbfishn

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    They were more interested in being bullies. One to use a "disability" as an excuse and they other to scare folks away. The couple with the baby, really nice young couple, were regular customers to. If they would have hurt that baby, they would have needed that gun.

    My point in this. You never know who or when someone will go off. Or how bad it will get. All I would have seen in the situation that cop was in is three people suddenly attacking me while I had a baby. No telling how badly the baby would be hurt in the process or who is going to care for it if I am beaten so bad I can't. No mention of mom being there. More than likely, just like that young couple until I stepped in and they could escape, all he saw was all kinds of danger for the child.

    Ok, show hands, if you were armed, who here would let 3 people beat you while you just curled up and hoped you could protect that child?

    My hand is NOT up.

    Sent by an idjit coffeeholic from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk
     

    Sublime

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    Let's wait for the video. Weren't you defending the HPD clown squad that murdered 2 people in their own home as well?

    Eli

    Why do you want to wait for the video now? I thought you summed it up pretty well earlier. Let's be honest, the clowns were an anomaly. Right?
     

    Eli

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    https://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-costco-shooting-explainer-narrative-20190619-story.html
    Before the officer fired his gun, there was a gap in time when he declared he was a police officer and French’s father stepped between the two men. Galipo said the security video showed that interaction.
    ...
    Galipo said that the officer’s life was not threatened and that he instead acted out of anger because someone had pushed him.

    https://www.latimes.com/california/...dly-shooting-off-duty-lapd-officer-disability
    The Times requested a copy of surveillance video from inside the store in late June, citing both California public records laws and AB 748, which requires government agencies to produce video and audio recordings of critical incidents involving police that result in death or great bodily injury. That request was denied by the city and The Times appealed the decision.

    Then, in response, prosecutors last month sought a court order that would prevent the release of video from inside the store, said John Hall, a spokesman for the Riverside County district attorney’s office.

    “Additionally, the court finds that due to the graphic nature of the video and the significant public attention on the shooting, the release of the video prior to the conclusion of the criminal investigation reasonably could result in harm to the suspect, who is out of custody, and could interfere with the integrity of the jury trial process in any potential subsequent prosecution,” Keen wrote in his decision.
    (Emphasis added by me.)

    Civil rights attorney Dale K. Galipo, who is representing the French family, acknowledged that Kenneth French pushed the officer, but said the exchange wasn’t a justification for the shooting.

    Before the officer fired his gun, there was a gap in time when he declared he was a police officer and French’s father stepped between the two men.

    Sounding more and more like officer A-hole decided to start popping caps in a crowded store without justification. Sixty days later and still not cleared on Use of Force when there's video of the incident? They're stalling to let outrage die down, he'll likely be arrested when there's other big headlines
    I suspect the 'knock out' was likely a drug-induced blackout (roid rage? sleep deprivation? effects of prescription psychotropic or other narcotics?) which resulted in the (drug-addled) officer opening fire on an unarmed man and his elderly parents in a crowded store.

    Eli
     

    Sublime

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    Wouldn't the video belong to Costco and thus not be applicable to the law cited? Apparently they did not want to give the LATimes the video and they took it to court and a judge ruled.
    Your theory is but one in many. Why do you suspect the knock out was a drug induced blackout? If the LATimes had evidence of that, don't you think they would run with that? They most likely have nothing and thus want to see the tape.
     

    Eli

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    Time has proven me largely correct, here's a couple of updates on this:
    Highlights:
    $17MM in damages to the victim's family.
    Officer fired by LAPD for excessive force.
    Officer awaiting trial on manslaughter and assault charges.

    Officer opened fire (10 rounds) in a crowded Costco after 'believing he had been shot' and the victim 'had a gun' - evidence says otherwise, victim was 20+ feet away.

    ETA:
    The lawsuit states that Kenneth, Russell and Paola French posed no immediate threat to Sanchez because they were moving away from him at the time of the shooting, which is supported by surveillance video and the fact that Kenneth and Paola were shot in the back.

    Eli
     
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