Stop sign ticket question.

pronstar · Dec 11, 2019

[QUOTE="txinvestigator, post: 2003168, member: 579"{
Both my ex wife and daughter have received red light camera tickets, both swore they stopped, just not " for long". The video showed the complete fail to stop...lol.[/QUOTE]

Yeah my mom got one of those...swore up and down that she came to a stop.

Watched the video link, she didn’t even slow down LOL

Of course in CA, it’s a $600 ticket

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ZX9RCAM · Dec 11, 2019

txinvestigator said:
Years ago I found the appellant decision that defined stop as "the cessation of all movement"

I can also tell you as a person trained in interviewing and interrogation, that what she is saying is typical of someone trying to minimize the impact of an act. It's normal.

Both my ex wife and daughter have received red light camera tickets, both swore they stopped, just not " for long". The video showed the complete fail to stop...lol.

As I said, who knows what the truth is.....

:green:

vmax · Dec 11, 2019

ZX9RCAM said:
But, did you come to a complete stop?

I thought I did...the cop had a different opinion

Charlie · Dec 11, 2019

Stop is a "stop". Not a "rolling stop". No such thing. Stop, hesitate, then go. Easy to understand.

Vaquero · Dec 11, 2019

Had a small town officer issue a "stop sign" ticket to a friend once. My buddy claimed he stopped fully. Officer replied, and I quote, "Your front wheels stopped, but your rear wheels were still rolling". Land of the accordion coup I guess.

SQLGeek · Dec 11, 2019

Vaquero said:
Had a small town officer issue a "stop sign" ticket to a friend once. My buddy claimed he stopped fully. Officer replied, and I quote, "Your front wheels stopped, but your rear wheels were still rolling". Land of the accordion coup I guess.

Who knew they made a slinky dog car?

ZX9RCAM · Dec 11, 2019

Vaquero said:
Had a small town officer issue a "stop sign" ticket to a friend once. My buddy claimed he stopped fully. Officer replied, and I quote, "Your front wheels stopped, but your rear wheels were still rolling". Land of the accordion coup I guess.

That's called a "power brake" stop....

:green:

txinvestigator · Dec 11, 2019

I only wrote stop sign tickets if it was clear to me the operator would not have been able to fully stop at the proper spot even if a full stop wasn't made . If it was clear the intent was to stop if necessary then I left it alone. I am talking about those barely moving situations

Brains · Dec 11, 2019

If I feel the calipers lock on the rotor, and the tires aren't sliding that's stopped. If a cop ever felt otherwise, I'd have fun in court with it.

Mowingmaniac 24/7 · Dec 11, 2019

I always stop a bit longer than I think absolutely necessary to be in compliance with the law and that practice has never failed...

When I was a kid an old guy that had been a chauffeur for years told me how doing this had saved him from being crashed into more than once.

It's a good practice.......

benenglish · Dec 11, 2019

I used to know of a couple of motorcyclists who had been issued tickets for stopping without putting a foot down. Both told me that when they got pulled over, the police officer told them that it was impossible to come to a complete stop without putting a foot down. That is, of course, completely wrong in fact and, afaik, almost universally in law, too. It didn't get them out of the ticket, though.

The link above is from California because it was the first I found. In Texas, the DPS publishes a Texas Motorcycle Operation Manual that, on page 25, clearly instructs motorcyclists to stop twice at every stop sign, once behind the sign and then again after creeping forward to be certain of no potential crossing traffic. I sincerely doubt anybody does that consistently; I know I never did.

TXI has already provided a definition of "stop" that doesn't require touching down.

I said all that to say this: Cam, is there any chance the lady was on a bike?

Shady · Dec 12, 2019

was probably an improper stop ticket. She did stop but was over the line or past the sign.

ZX9RCAM · Dec 12, 2019

benenglish said:
I used to know of a couple of motorcyclists who had been issued tickets for stopping without putting a foot down. Both told me that when they got pulled over, the police officer told them that it was impossible to come to a complete stop without putting a foot down. That is, of course, completely wrong in fact and, afaik, almost universally in law, too. It didn't get them out of the ticket, though.

The link above is from California because it was the first I found. In Texas, the DPS publishes a Texas Motorcycle Operation Manual that, on page 25, clearly instructs motorcyclists to stop twice at every stop sign, once behind the sign and then again after creeping forward to be certain of no potential crossing traffic. I sincerely doubt anybody does that consistently; I know I never did.

TXI has already provided a definition of "stop" that doesn't require touching down.

I said all that to say this: Cam, is there any chance the lady was on a bike?

Not on a motorcycle.

I had never heard of the motorcycle rule of "stop twice" either.

DyeF9 · Dec 12, 2019

Shady said:
was probably an improper stop ticket. She did stop but was over the line or past the sign.

Sounds pretty petty

txinvestigator · Dec 12, 2019

ZX9RCAM said:
Not on a motorcycle.

I had never heard of the motorcycle rule of "stop twice" either.

It is not a law to stop twice, but DPS suggests it for motorcyclists for two reasons

If you stop at the stop bar and then proceed you may miss seeing traffic. If you simply pull up to where you can clearly see cross traffic then you passed the stop bar and didn't comply with the law.

ZX9RCAM · Dec 12, 2019

Interesting.
Stopping twice is not suggested for drivers of vehicles though?
What is the difference?

Couldn't a bike rider be able to see better?

Wiliamr · Dec 12, 2019

Texas Transportation Code Chapter 7
Sec. 544.010. STOP SIGNS AND YIELD SIGNS. (a) Unless directed to proceed by a police officer or traffic-control signal, the operator of a vehicle or streetcar approaching an intersection with a stop sign shall stop as provided by Subsection (c).

(b) If safety requires, the operator of a vehicle approaching a yield sign shall stop as provided by Subsection (c).

(c) An operator required to stop by this section shall stop before entering the crosswalk on the near side of the intersection. In the absence of a crosswalk, the operator shall stop at a clearly marked stop line. In the absence of a stop line, the operator shall stop at the place nearest the intersecting roadway where the operator has a view of approaching traffic on the intersecting roadway.

Acts 1995, 74th Leg., ch. 165, Sec. 1, eff. Sept. 1, 1995.

Brains · Dec 12, 2019

Mowingmaniac 24/7 said:
I always stop a bit longer than I think absolutely necessary to be in compliance with the law and that practice has never failed...

When I was a kid an old guy that had been a chauffeur for years told me how doing this had saved him from being crashed into more than once.

It's a good practice.......

Definitely a good practice, but an even better one is to keep your eyes constantly scanning your surroundings. That way you'll already be aware of any other vehicles that might enter the intersection after your signal goes green, pedestrians, car coming behind you failing to stop, etc.

LONG time ago, but when that was something they drilled into our heads when I took drivers education as a kid. Your eyes should never dwell in one place for more than a second or so.

avvidclif · Dec 12, 2019

Those who say a motorcyclist cannot stop without putting their feet down have never seen a "Slow Race". That's where the last bike across the finish line is the winner. If you put a foot down you lose. They are hilarious to watch. Usually about 100' long.

At the gun everyone must start moving. All start out as slow as possible except at one race a guy took off like a bat out of hell. Got to about 5' from the finish line and stopped, feet up, and waited until all the rest had either put a foot down or crossed the finish line. He then crossed the line and won. He was stationary for abt 2 minutes. My balance isn't that good.

TAZ · Dec 12, 2019

Not for not stopping long enough. Rolling through one without actually stopping cause traffic was clear at that moment - yup.

Sounds like she rolled through the stop sign. I can’t imagine anyone writing a ticket for not stopping long enough. That would be a serious case of needledickery.

Stop sign ticket question.

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