Hurley's Gold

Best place to test out/rent rifles (Daniel Defense, HK, etc.)

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  • RSBro

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    I'm looking at making a purchase for a new AR end of year/first of next year. I've kind of narrowed it down to a Daniel Defense M4A1 or MK18 (SBR), but also looking at the HK MR556, just because why not? Open to other rifles in this same range that are reliable and relatively hold their value well, but is there anywhere in the Houston area that has these level of rifles in stock to test out at the range? With a purchase like this I'd like to try and get my hands on "the" same model, and not just something close or comparable. I may end up deciding on something else, depending on how it feels/fires, as is usually the case (just like cars...). I'm on the NW side but open to traveling anywhere for the right units. Thanks in advance!
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    zackmars

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    Knights armament.

    HK MR556's are heavy and overpriced, and the barrels are inferior to even what you'd get on a $300 build

    DD rifles are nice, but expensive for what is just a normal AR. DD MK18 barrels are stupid overgassed, and will eat bolts in the long term

    Kac is expensive, but kac actually makes improvements to the ar, better gas system, better lowers, better bolts, etc.

    LaRue is also nice, BCM is another option
     

    Over it

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    Mar 17, 2015
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    Knights armament.

    HK MR556's are heavy and overpriced, and the barrels are inferior to even what you'd get on a $300 build

    DD rifles are nice, but expensive for what is just a normal AR. DD MK18 barrels are stupid overgassed, and will eat bolts in the long term

    Kac is expensive, but kac actually makes improvements to the ar, better gas system, better lowers, better bolts, etc.

    LaRue is also nice, BCM is another option

    Um, I wouldn't agree. HK barrels are some of the nicest made. No other barrel on that list can take a squib and then have the subsequent round push the squib out and continue operating. Very accurate barrels at that. The barrels that come in the Mr556 are identical in manufacture to a 416 barrel sans the chrome lining. Even without chrome, I'd expect it too last 10k plus rounds. And at the 10K mark, you need to take a critical look at all the components anyways.
     
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    DyeF9

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    Um, I wouldn't agree. HK barrels are some of the nicest made. No other barrel on that list can take a squib and then have the subsequent round push the squib out and continue operating. Very accurate barrels at that. The barrels that come in the Mr556 are identical in manufacture to a 416 barrel sans the chrome lining. Even without chrome, I'd expect it too last 10k plus rounds. If you can find it, Henderson has a small write up about their range rental MR556 still going strong after 10K rounds.
    I would hope they can last more than 10k rounds. There's plenty of barrels that can run an easy 30k

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    Over it

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    I would hope they can last more than 10k rounds. There's plenty of barrels that can run an easy 30k

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    Which barrel claims that? Barrels are like tires in a way (minus the dry rot). If you drive your car around the block once everyday in a sane fashion, it'll last a very long time. If you commute regularly longer distances the tire life will be shorter. Usually when you run an AR-15 hard, its the gas port erosion, throat erosion that gets you. Adjustable gas blocks, different buffers are just a crutch to keep an out of spec barrel running.
     

    DyeF9

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    Which barrel claims that? Barrels are like tires in a way (minus the dry rot). If you drive your car around the block once everyday in a sane fashion, it'll last a very long time. If you commute regularly longer distances the tire life will be shorter. Usually when you run an AR-15 hard, its the gas port erosion, throat erosion that gets you. Adjustable gas blocks, different buffers are just a crutch to keep an out of spec barrel running.
    It also depends on what you're doing with it. If you're doing long range precision and hand loads, then chances are they're gonna be all hung up on throat erosion and what not. If you're pumping factory rounds at the range, chances are it'll be 20 to 30k before you care about any changes in how it runs.

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    Over it

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    It also depends on what you're doing with it. If you're doing long range precision and hand loads, then chances are they're gonna be all hung up on throat erosion and what not. If you're pumping factory rounds at the range, chances are it'll be 20 to 30k before you care about any changes in how it runs.

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    Very true. We would need to settle on a standard of what 'in spec' is, guess it would vary from person to person. For me, it would be cross between adverse effect on reliability and increased dispersion from factory spec. I own too many AR's and I've never shot out a rifle. I've been trying to burn out an LMT MRP 14.5" because I have a 10.5" barrel I want to install on that, but man, that thing just doesn't quit.
     

    DyeF9

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    Very true. We would need to settle on a standard of what 'in spec' is, guess it would vary from person to person. For me, it would be cross between adverse effect on reliability and increased dispersion from factory spec. I own too many AR's and I've never shot out a rifle. I've been trying to burn out an LMT MRP 14.5" because I have a 10.5" barrel I want to install on that, but man, that thing just doesn't quit.
    Good rifles like to run, even if it starts spreading out a bit, if you don't need less than 4 moa for what you're doing, they're gonna go like the Energizer Bunny

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    zackmars

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    Um, I wouldn't agree. HK barrels are some of the nicest made. No other barrel on that list can take a squib and then have the subsequent round push the squib out and continue operating. Very accurate barrels at that. The barrels that come in the Mr556 are identical in manufacture to a 416 barrel sans the chrome lining. Even without chrome, I'd expect it too last 10k plus rounds. And at the 10K mark, you need to take a critical look at all the components anyways.

    Sorry, but you are incorrect

    https://www.ar15.com/forums/ar-15/High-round-count-AR-M4-s-over-100-000-rounds-and-how-they-have-handled-on-our-range/118-677135/

    "We no longer use ANY piston conversions or factory pistons guns with the exception of the HK-416 "knock-off" TDI upper. I purchased a FACTORY brand-new MR556 and it started keyholing after only 10,000 rounds. I was SO pissed because I spent all that money on the gun and it couldn't last 10,000 rounds. I had barrels from before we even opened the range with 1,000's of rounds on them from J&T Distributing (chrome-lined) that didn't keyhole well into the 80,000-100,000 range."

    A life of 10k on a gun that costs close to, or over 3k is unacceptable.

    And sure, hk barrels are accurate, but any decent AR will shoot better, for longer

    All while being MUCH cheaper.

    And afaik, shooting out a squib in a 5.56 barrel is steyr's gimmik
     
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    RSBro

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    I've heard pretty much similar sentiments about the HK as posted in this thread, but was just looking at them just in case I found one on a deal too good to pass up, which happens in the gun/car world often.

    I've really only read decent things about DD, which I've been reading reviews on this site, others like it, etc. for the last 6-9 months. Never heard of Kac, LaRue or BCM. However, as mentioned in the OP, I'm really open to trying out as many rifles as I can, and if I find one or two or three I really like, I can go back and do some reading on them before pulling the trigger, so to speak... I'm not a pro shooter or anything, and only shoot factory loads so I don't have real concerns about wearing out a barrel TBH.

    I know I've heard advertisements for places that do this on radio while listening to Walton & Johnson or Michael Berry, etc., names just escape me...

    EDIT: Derp, just searched and realized KAC is a vendor, not location. Also, one place I just recalled was Boyert Shooting Center, and I know there are others.

    What are thoughts about LWRC? I have a client who swears by them, but they are definitely $$, more in the HK and higher range.
     
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    zackmars

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    I've heard pretty much similar sentiments about the HK as posted in this thread, but was just looking at them just in case I found one on a deal too good to pass up, which happens in the gun/car world often.

    I've really only read decent things about DD, which I've been reading reviews on this site, others like it, etc. for the last 6-9 months. Never heard of Kac, LaRue or BCM. However, as mentioned in the OP, I'm really open to trying out as many rifles as I can, and if I find one or two or three I really like, I can go back and do some reading on them before pulling the trigger, so to speak... I'm not a pro shooter or anything, and only shoot factory loads so I don't have real concerns about wearing out a barrel TBH.

    I know I've heard advertisements for places that do this on radio while listening to Walton & Johnson or Michael Berry, etc., names just escape me...

    EDIT: Derp, just searched and realized KAC is a vendor, not location. Also, one place I just recalled was Boyert Shooting Center, and I know there are others.

    What are thoughts about LWRC? I have a client who swears by them, but they are definitely $$, more in the HK and higher range.


    Their DI models are good, not a fan of the external piston ones.

    LaRue and KAC have been around quite awhile, larue is more established in the precision shooting world while KAC is more combat/duty oriented. KAC was the last company Eugene Stoner worked for, so you'd be hard pressed to find a company that knows the AR like they do.


    LMT is also a good brand. VLTOR and Radian also make nice rifles, but they're a bit on the gucci side.

    I may have missed it, have you considered building your own? So many companies make so many good parts that you really aren't going to find them all on one rifle
     

    RSBro

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    Their DI models are good, not a fan of the external piston ones.

    LaRue and KAC have been around quite awhile, larue is more established in the precision shooting world while KAC is more combat/duty oriented. KAC was the last company Eugene Stoner worked for, so you'd be hard pressed to find a company that knows the AR like they do.


    LMT is also a good brand. VLTOR and Radian also make nice rifles, but they're a bit on the gucci side.

    I may have missed it, have you considered building your own? So many companies make so many good parts that you really aren't going to find them all on one rifle

    Re: LWRC, I thought the piston/IC models is what they were known for? I'm really considering a ~14" barrel, so doesn't look like they make that in the DI model.

    I will check out LaRue and KAC. Never heard of either frankly, but I know there are lots of great options out there, which leads me to the next point re: builds-
    I have looked at building, but IMO getting something built lets you keep resale better and also opens up trades, which I'm prone to do and always have with handguns when I want to try something new. I think a build (I have a client who loves doing this) would be down the road, but not for what I want/need right now.
     

    zackmars

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    Re: LWRC, I thought the piston/IC models is what they were known for? I'm really considering a ~14" barrel, so doesn't look like they make that in the DI model.

    I will check out LaRue and KAC. Never heard of either frankly, but I know there are lots of great options out there, which leads me to the next point re: builds-
    I have looked at building, but IMO getting something built lets you keep resale better and also opens up trades, which I'm prone to do and always have with handguns when I want to try something new. I think a build (I have a client who loves doing this) would be down the road, but not for what I want/need right now.

    Lwrc is known for their external piston guns, but outside some short term benefits on niche guns (suppressed full auto SBR's), the juice isn't worth the squeeze. If you want a piston, you are better off getting a gun designed from the ground up to use one, like the SCAR, ACR, Tavor, CZ Bren, AUG, etc.

    And while a factory gun will have more resale value than a build, the AR market is so soft, the only way to (generally) not take a wash is to part the gun out.
     
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