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  • Landrover

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    Ok. I build a lot of ar15's and I have come across a lot of problems everyone needs to know about.
    1. Everybody coats differently
    2. Everybody has there own idea on what the tolerances should be.
    3. Everyone thinks SAAMI spec is SAAMI spec, its not.
    Here we go.
    1. Coatings:
    Almost everyone in the industry sends their stuff out to get coated. Not to many coat their own stuff. While things get coated, the coatings might be applied thicker than need be. So for this I use 080-598-180WB 1 3/16"-16 tpi Tap from Brownells to run the threads on the castle nut and lower receiver to clean out the threads from over coating and burs. I use 100-016-681WB AR-15 Buffer Tube Die 1 3/16"-16 on all my buffer tubes. I use 100-016-682WB AR-15 Upper Receiver Die 1 1/4-18" on the barrel nut threads. I use 080-598-528WB 1/2"-28 AR-15/M16 Tap on the Flash Suppressor bird cage, and 080-598-529WB AR-15/M16 Flash Suppressor Die. using these will clean up all threads and everything will mate faster and better.
    2. Tolerances:
    Ok after the machining process is completed and the part is in its raw state, all tolerances might be into spec. Now they go get coated and depending on who is coating them depends on if they stay in spec. I buy .250 reamers from Pacific Tool and Gauge to run my front and back take down pin holes.
    3. SAAMI spec.:
    Now I know I'm going to run into resistance on this but this is how it was explained to me by a renown know barrel reamer manufacture. There are 3 types of chamber specs out there. 2 SAAMI and 1 that is what ever the manufacture thinks it need to be. Now with that said, SAAMI has a semi auto spec and a bolt gun spec. Semi auto has to feed and extract automatically. So the chamber is loose. With a bole gun the chamber is tight. That's why bolt gun guys use SB die sets to get down to a tight tolerance for their chambers. I buy reamers for all my barrels just because I found out not everyone corks their barrels before coating. I have found a lot of chambers and land and grooves have been coated in the barrel coating process and I have lost chamber tolerance. A light reaming and polishing is what I do to every barrel before installation.

    That's just my 4 cents on the matter. I have fu%$ed up a lot of stuff and had to learn. Just passing it on so you don't waste any of your money on fu$# ups.
    Military Camp
     

    benenglish

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    That's why bolt gun guys use SB die sets to get down to a tight tolerance for their chambers.
    I'm in my normal state of confusion.

    I was under the impression that bolt gun guys can use neck-sizing dies and minimize body sizing if they want a tighter fit in chambers. I thought that small base (SB) sizing dies were for returning brass to minimum dimensions so it will work better in semi-autos. I thought that the applicability of small base dies for reloading for bolt-action firearms was pretty much nil, assuming you start with new brass.

    Have I got that wrong?
     

    Vaquero

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    I'm in my normal state of confusion.

    I was under the impression that bolt gun guys can use neck-sizing dies and minimize body sizing if they want a tighter fit in chambers. I thought that small base (SB) sizing dies were for returning brass to minimum dimensions so it will work better in semi-autos. I thought that the applicability of small base dies for reloading for bolt-action firearms was pretty much nil, assuming you start with new brass.

    Have I got that wrong?
    No.
    You're not wrong.
     

    Dawico

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    I'm in my normal state of confusion.

    I was under the impression that bolt gun guys can use neck-sizing dies and minimize body sizing if they want a tighter fit in chambers. I thought that small base (SB) sizing dies were for returning brass to minimum dimensions so it will work better in semi-autos. I thought that the applicability of small base dies for reloading for bolt-action firearms was pretty much nil, assuming you start with new brass.

    Have I got that wrong?
    I was going to quote the same section and respond similarly to you.

    SB dies are for autoloaders with tight chambers. I have never had the need to use them for any of my autoloaders though.
     

    avvidclif

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    I was always under the impression that the SB die sets were for the semi's to make sure they would feed. Regular dies for the bolt guys and neck sizing for your personally fired and the cases used in the same gun..
     

    benenglish

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    SB dies are for autoloaders with tight chambers.
    I've always felt they were also for once-fired surplus brass that may have been fired in generously-sized chambers, no matter in what type of firearm the cases will eventually be used. But maybe that's just me.

    Note - That's why I specified "assuming you start with new brass" in my first comment.
     

    TxStetson

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    I'm in my normal state of confusion.

    I was under the impression that bolt gun guys can use neck-sizing dies and minimize body sizing if they want a tighter fit in chambers. I thought that small base (SB) sizing dies were for returning brass to minimum dimensions so it will work better in semi-autos. I thought that the applicability of small base dies for reloading for bolt-action firearms was pretty much nil, assuming you start with new brass.

    Have I got that wrong?
    You are correct Ben. Bolt gun shooters use neck sizing dies only to increase accuracy because the shell casings are already fire formed to that guns chamber.
     

    Landrover

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    Once fired brass out of your bolt gun yes you are right. Using brass fired from a semi auto in your bolt gun u will need a SB die
     

    Landrover

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    I have a Remington 700 in 308 and some others in 300 win mag and ultra. A standard die set will not get me into those chambers. I have to run a RCBS SB die set for each one. The standard die sets won't work on my guns. Now the std will work for my semi auto just not for my bolt.
     

    Vaquero

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    Once fired brass out of your bolt gun yes you are right. Using brass fired from a semi auto in your bolt gun u will need a SB die
    I use a standard die.
    Lots of LC brass and no problem yet.
    I'm feeding a few ARs, a savage bolt gun and a old New England break open.
    I never have seen the need for a SB die.
     

    Gummi Bear

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    I cover and/or grease all threads before coating. I don’t own the taps to chase those threads. I will ream and chase things as necessary.

    I do use SB dies on all 223, since I reload in such quantity, they could be going in any number of rifles when I get together with my family or buddies.

    It is reassuring to learn that some of my OCD tendencies are mimics of other more experienced builders.



    I went to the woods because I wished to live deliberately...

    Henry David Thoreau
     

    Landrover

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    I cover and/or grease all threads before coating. I don’t own the taps to chase those threads. I will ream and chase things as necessary.

    I do use SB dies on all 223, since I reload in such quantity, they could be going in any number of rifles when I get together with my family or buddies.

    It is reassuring to learn that some of my OCD tendencies are mimics of other more experienced builders.



    I went to the woods because I wished to live deliberately...

    Henry David Thoreau
    Hey try taking a Dremel and polishing your chambers. It will help too
     

    Gummi Bear

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    Yessir. I do that. Some Flitz and a cotton attachment and off I go.

    I do that with darn near every internal part of an 870, they go from a stamped out piece of crap to a smooth machine with a few hours invested in polishing.



    I went to the woods because I wished to live deliberately...

    Henry David Thoreau
     

    Dawico

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    I use a standard die.
    Lots of LC brass and no problem yet.
    I'm feeding a few ARs, a savage bolt gun and a old New England break open.
    I never have seen the need for a SB die.
    This is my experience as well. 5.56, 7.62 Nato, even once fired 30.06 and 50 BMG military brass sized with regular dies have never given me issues in my bolt guns.
     

    Dawico

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    Getting back to the hart of the thread. Building ar15's. Anyone have any problems with coating build ups on threads?
    Not on ARs so to speak since I don't build them but can definitely see that being handy.

    I have had plenty of galvanized bolts that could benefit from having the threads cleaned up though. Galvanized nuts are supposed to be threaded bigger to allow for the build up but switching manufacturers can give problems. Twisted off three 5/8" anchor bolts just the other day because the nuts wouldn't run down them.
     
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