A Message to the Church of Bill of Sale

[ZX9RCAM]

An attorney should be able to defend that pretty easy IF it came to that. You can also turn that around. What if you sold to a prohibited person and a LE comes back to you even if you didn't get an ID. You plan to lie to LE that you didn't sell the gun?

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I sold the gun, I didn't get his name, I'm not required to....

 

[V-Tach]

Plates and registration sticker stay with me when I sell a vehicle......they're mine .......they can get a temporary.......

 

[easy rider]

Ah. In the states I've owned cars, plates had to be surrendered upon sale or transferred to another vehicle you own (e.g.,a new car).

Not in the socialist left coast.

 

[Bithabus]

=What if you sold to a prohibited person and a LE comes back to you even if you didn't get an ID. You plan to lie to LE that you didn't sell the gun?

"He told me he could legally own the firearm, and there was no indication that he was prohibited. No, I didn't log his info because I am not legally required to".

End of story.

 

[karlac]

Ah. In the states I've owned cars, plates had to be surrendered upon sale or transferred to another vehicle you own (e.g.,a new car).

FWIW, Texas now has a form which can be filled out and submitted on line which protects you from liability mentioned in the post you replied to, if submitted within 30 days.

 

[Bithabus]

I get both sides. Personally, if I’m in the transaction, I’m going to use a BOS on either end (if I buy or sell).


If you are asking me “why?”, I’ll tell you “same reason I have a fire extinguisher in my kitchen...If shit gets hot for me, I want some protection. “

You see, the difference is a fire extinguisher can help you by putting out a fire. The BOS cannot help you. It has never helped anyone, but it has put people in jail.

You believe a BOS can "help" you because someone has fed you incorrect information.

 

[sharkey]

I sold the gun, I didn't get his name, I'm not required to....

Yeah they wouldn't have a photo.to show you or anything. My point is either you know or don't know if the purchaser is a prohibited person so having.a.copy.of their ID.does not make a difference.

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[ZX9RCAM]

Yeah they wouldn't have a photo.to show you or anything. My point is either you know or don't know if the purchaser is a prohibited person so having.a.copy.of their ID.does not make a difference.

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So then why do you photograph IDs?

I'm pretty sure you've stated previously in this thread that you do....

ETA:

I always photograph a DL or LTC. Don't like it, don't buy a gun from me. I dont care when someone asks for it from me.

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[Texasgordo]

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[diesel1959]

As a seller, it's not my duty to be certain the buyer is not a prohibited person. It's only my duty not to sell if I have reason to believe the buyer is a prohibited person. Hoji and a bunch of other folks smarter than me will explain the difference between those two instances. Sellers who get BOSs are basically providing evidence against themselves and taking away their best defense.

 

[karlac]

As a seller, it's not my duty to be certain the buyer is not a prohibited person. It's only my duty not to sell if I have reason to believe the buyer is a prohibited person. Hoji and a bunch of other folks smarter than me will explain the difference between those two instances. Sellers who get BOSs are basically providing evidence against themselves and taking away their best defense.

^ If there was sanity in this world, that would be the EOT ...

 

[Renegade]

I get both sides. Personally, if I’m in the transaction, I’m going to use a BOS on either end (if I buy or sell).

Your choice.

Shipley, the FBI Agent, sold a 50BMG to a Sheriff Deputy and used a BOS. The Sheriff Deputy in turn sold it to someone else (and the gun turned up in Mexico) and did not use a BOS. Guess which one went to Federal Prison?

 

[ZX9RCAM]

Interesting.
I wonder how the connection between the Sherriff and the guy with no BOS got discovered?

 

[Renegade]

Interesting.
I wonder how the connection between the Sherriff and the guy with no BOS got discovered?

Gun was found in Mexico and traced to Shipley who had BOS selling it to Sheriff, trail ended there.

 

[ZX9RCAM]

Gun was found in Mexico and traced to Shipley who had BOS selling it to Sheriff, trail ended there.

So, did the Sheriff deny buying it?
He claimed the BOS to him was fake?
I don't get it.

 

[AustinN4]

So, did the Sheriff deny buying it? He claimed the BOS to him was fake? I don't get it.

Shipley, I believe got nailed for dealing guns for profit without a license. But I could be wrong. I was 1 time about 38 years ago.

 

[Renegade]

So, did the Sheriff deny buying it?
He claimed the BOS to him was fake?
I don't get it.

The Deputy did not keeps record. Thus they had no idea how many guns he sold like they did with Shipley. They had no evidence he sold to a prohibited person. He protected himself by not incriminating himself, even though he was closer to the sale of the gun to Mexico than Shipley.

 

[Renegade]

Shipley, I believe got nailed for dealing guns for profit without a license. But I could be wrong. I was 1 time about 38 years ago.

He had a lot of chargeable offenses, but his BOS records are what got him in trouble. No records, no case.

The Deputy had no records, so they had no case against him.

 

[V-Tach]

Seems I remember a fairly recent story about a cop who bought a blue label glock for his uncle. Cop lived in NC or somewhere and the Uncle who was a retired cop lived in NJ or thereabouts. The retired cop uncle wanted a good deal on the Glock and his cop nephew took his uncle's money and purchased the blue label glock and gave it to his uncle.......he filled out a BOS to his Uncle..........ATF filed on the cop for a straw man purchase on the basis of the BOS........I'll see if I can find the story later when I have time....we may have discussed it here on TGT....point was....if no BOS.....ATF would have never known or had a case to file....

 

[easy rider]

Seems I remember a fairly recent story about a cop who bought a blue label glock for his uncle. Cop lived in NC or somewhere and the Uncle who was a retired cop lived in NJ or thereabouts. The retired cop uncle wanted a good deal on the Glock and his cop nephew took his uncle's money and purchased the blue label glock and gave it to his uncle.......he filled out a BOS to his Uncle..........ATF filed on the cop for a straw man purchase on the basis of the BOS........I'll see if I can find the story later when I have time....we may have discussed it here on TGT....point was....if no BOS.....ATF would have never known or had a case to file....

It wasn't the BOS that made it illegal when buying with the intent to sell to someone else makes it illegal. The BOS may have helped make the case, but BOS are not illegal in themselves.